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Straight gamer told to "get over it"

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Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby rowan » Sat Mar 26, 15:08 2011

I used to play computer RPGs a lot. The countless hours I spent on games like Baldur's Gate, and even more when I got into online ones - Ultima Online in particular - ate up a lot of my free time. I eventually left UO because of the player-killing aspect, which made me sad because otherwise UO was definitely a favorite. I picked up EverQuest after that but it wasn't as good - except for the ability to opt-out of the PKing aspect.

And then I quit.

Why? You might ask. Was it the stupid comments by other players? Their contributions to rape culture? Actually, not really. In fact, back then, you might be surprised to know, people didn't use "rape" so much to describe defeating another group - I'm sure it happened, but even in the player killing environment of UO I didn't hear it much. So, was it the objectification of women? Certainly EQ had skimpier outfits that was an aspect I did not like very much. But, par for the course, I could be disgusted and annoyed by it but still play. (I mean really, do you think bikini chain mail would do anything for protection in a fight?) So what was it that made me quit? In reality: my wrists. But today, I'm downloading a demo for a new game: Dragon Age 2.

I know that this will hurt my wrists (but maybe I can managed to limit my play-time; after all I have a kid now, and a time consuming job). I expect I will find aspects that will find things that annoy me. But you know what? I kind of feel like I should give this one a chance. Maybe it'll surprise me... it has been a very long time since I've played. And I have hope, because they've decided that relationships are for everyone.

Of course, someone (a straight male gamer, who claimed to speak for "all" straight male gamers) complained. Their response was shockingly ... reasonable:

And if there is any doubt why such an opinion might be met with hostility, it has to do with privilege. You can write it off as “political correctness” if you wish, but the truth is that privilege always lies with the majority. They’re so used to being catered to that they see the lack of catering as an imbalance. They don’t see anything wrong with having things set up to suit them, what’s everyone’s fuss all about? That’s the way it should be, any everyone else should be used to not getting what they want.

[...]

The very best we can do is give everyone a little bit of choice, and that’s what we tried here.

And the person who says that the only way to please them is to restrict options for others is, if you ask me, the one who deserves it least. And that’s my opinion, expressed as politely as possible.


I can only hope that this attitude carries over to the rest of the game. I've downloaded the demo - but I may just have to pick up this game on principle, if only to support people in the gaming industry who actually think everyone deserves options. There's a stereotype out there that only straight male gamers are out here - it's clearly not true, and it's nice to see a company acknowledge that and then do something about it.

Perhaps it's time I paid attention to the game industry again too.


Read the actual complaint and the full response here: http://www.nomorelost.org/2011/03/25/st ... y-bioware/ so you don't have to wade through the forums.

Sticking this in Sci Tech instead of Feminism 'cuz why not?
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby rowan » Sat Mar 26, 15:12 2011

And now you can all tell me if DA2 is worth buying, and whether or not Bioware actually has been reasonable for longer than just now (so says someone on FB). :P
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby cwbyrvr » Sat Mar 26, 16:50 2011

I haven't played Dragon Age yet though I've been wanting to buy the first one lately. I recently quit playing WoW so I have time now for other games. I've heard mostly great things about the first game, with a few exceptions. What I've heard so far about the second one seems to be a bit all over the place, but still probably mostly positive. I wasn't aware that there were "relationships" in the game, which is an interesting aspect to an RPG, something I've not come across. That sounds intriguing to me, at least.

And the response this guy got was perfect. He was definitely spouting some really stupid crap and I'm glad he got the right response to that. This makes me want to start playing this series even more now.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby Sonic# » Sat Mar 26, 22:23 2011

Wow. That complainant really throws out the stereotypes, doesn't he? "Oh, they just play their Sims."

And I guess the most improbable thing of all about his comments is that sexual relationships in these games are choices. If you're halfway paying attention to what responses you're clicking, and you don't want a relationship, you're good. Why these relationships being available would be troublesome is beyond me. Perhaps he associates negatively with characters that are functionally bisexual.

I saw someone else make a similar complaint to this one on Kotaku. It amounted to, "Why are the relationship choices so bland? Making them all bisexual has made them less desirable for me." And the editor's response was basically, "Lookin' good from here!"
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby Neko » Sun Mar 27, 9:38 2011

I'm so a David Gaider fan now.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby cwbyrvr » Mon Mar 28, 14:12 2011

I bought Dragon Age Origins yesterday. Played for 8 straight hours. Was really fun. Today, however, I cannot access my save files. I bought the "ultimate edition" which came with the expansion and some content that was previously only available through paid download. Today it says my downloadable content is unauthorized and will not let me continue. I've spent a couple hours now trying every fix I've found suggested, have run out of options, and still can't get it to work.

I'd say to avoid this company on PC (basically it's EA, so I had a feeling I would have issues... just was hopeful the game would at least remain playable). I am now trying to figure out how to contact them for a refund, as the store isn't exactly responsible for this, but I'm kind of sick of dealing it with it for now.

Had issues with the install as well, first attempt failed, then it wouldn't take my key because I had just used it. A restart fixed that, at least. Dunno if these issues are still present in DA 2 but just thought I'd vent my frustrations here a bit and let you know what you might be dealing with if you buy this.
spacefem wrote:incidently, hearing "i love you" doesn't count if you're naked. it's just too easy to love a naked person.

RD wrote:My armpits are the only area of my body that almost always stays clean-shaven, because if I let it go I feel like a 15-year-old boy trying to grow a beard. In my armpits.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby Sonic# » Mon Mar 28, 16:23 2011

^ Are there any keys you have to put in for the expansion that you haven't? It seems like their tech support would at least be all over that. Then again, I don't play many EA games.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby cwbyrvr » Tue Mar 29, 2:29 2011

All the keys were active, I played the game for a night then when I tried to play it again it had lost my authentication. I spent 5 hours trying to get it to work, hoping I could avoid having to reinstall, but that was finally what it came down to. First I found a series of files/folders to delete, seemed like it was gonna work, everything downloaded fine and it said it was authorized... tried to load my save and it had lost the expansion pack so I still couldn't access it. At this point I just gave up and uninstalled/reinstalled. Was hoping I could spend most of my day off playing, that didn't quite pan out.

Finally got it working, but that was way more of a pain in the ass than should ever be acceptable. And there's a good chance I'll come across it again and have to reinstall again... rather often. It's a common issue, apparently, though I had read a bit about it before buying the game, I was under the impression it was rare. After all the searching I did today I realized it's extremely common and there are about a dozen "fixes" for it. None permanent. :\ Though I also read a good number of posts from people saying they've never come across it so I guess it's partly luck.

That said, I totally got laid in-game tonight, oh yeah.
spacefem wrote:incidently, hearing "i love you" doesn't count if you're naked. it's just too easy to love a naked person.

RD wrote:My armpits are the only area of my body that almost always stays clean-shaven, because if I let it go I feel like a 15-year-old boy trying to grow a beard. In my armpits.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby imogene the fish » Tue Mar 29, 17:09 2011

The gamer guy doesn't get it, though. From his response:
In fact, what Gaider basically said was that "You're right. Dragon Age 2 was not made specifically for "straight male gamer" in mind. It was made to be all-inclusive." And that was exactly the accusation I was making.

He then goes on to say that he's not here to judge, but he thinks homosexuality is disgusting. He does not understand what's wrong with his view. He thinks that as long as one group makes up the majority of population, that group is the only one that should be served. He maintains that not being served exclusively = being neglected. Really, though, it's probably about homophobia. He complains about demographics, but you don't see every straight male gamer objecting. If the main character you had to play was black, I doubt he would complain about neglecting whites.

So while I love Gaider's response, it does not appear to have been affective on the original complainer. However, it may have had an impact on others who read it. It's still a great response. This guy's skull is a little too thick right now.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby rowan » Tue Mar 29, 19:06 2011

Well, it's generally not going to impact idiots like that. I mean, look at the trolls we get here... we try but...

What it does do is exactly what you say - it impacts other people. Not just those who read it, but people who play games. And it makes gaming more open to more people.

(unlike this which just makes me want to hurl.)
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby imogene the fish » Tue Mar 29, 20:41 2011

rowan wrote:Well, it's generally not going to impact idiots like that. I mean, look at the trolls we get here... we try but...

What it does do is exactly what you say - it impacts other people. Not just those who read it, but people who play games. And it makes gaming more open to more people.

(unlike this which just makes me want to hurl.)

Oh wow! That is disgusting. "Capture the babe" instead of capture the flag? Cuz women are treated as objects enough in the gaming industry. No, they have to be as blatant as they can be.

I guess I was just hoping "Straight Male Gamer" would have a shred of shame or apology. Or at least get off his high horse. Can't win 'em all, though. As well as it was written, Gaider's response had to have gotten through to someone.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby edit the sad parts » Wed Mar 30, 10:10 2011

What a kick-ass response. I am not really a gamer, but that kind of sentiment from the creators makes me want to support their projects and check them out. Hooray for inclusiveness.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby cwbyrvr » Wed Mar 30, 21:57 2011

The more I've played the first game, the more I wish it had this sort of feature as well. Though the way it's set up in this one is more realistic (only certain NPCs go both ways, rather than all of them), there are some people I totally wish I could romance without having to be the opposite gender... I'm addicted to achievements.
spacefem wrote:incidently, hearing "i love you" doesn't count if you're naked. it's just too easy to love a naked person.

RD wrote:My armpits are the only area of my body that almost always stays clean-shaven, because if I let it go I feel like a 15-year-old boy trying to grow a beard. In my armpits.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby monk » Fri Apr 1, 11:38 2011

Penny arcade's take is hilarious. linky


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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby Neko » Fri Apr 1, 14:00 2011

^^ I laughed but I don't like the implication that right after gay marriage comes interspecies marriage/couples.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby monk » Fri Apr 1, 14:13 2011

It's all about consent, if you can get the animal to pass a maturity test then speak and give consent, I have no problem with that either. Most dragons know how to speak (at least they do in my neck of the imagination)
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby cwbyrvr » Fri Apr 1, 16:30 2011

That dragon does not look like it's about to consent...

Thought I'd pop in and note I haven't had any more issues with the first game so far... so far.
spacefem wrote:incidently, hearing "i love you" doesn't count if you're naked. it's just too easy to love a naked person.

RD wrote:My armpits are the only area of my body that almost always stays clean-shaven, because if I let it go I feel like a 15-year-old boy trying to grow a beard. In my armpits.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby SakuraSong » Sat May 7, 12:02 2011

I wasn't aware that there were "relationships" in the game, which is an interesting aspect to an RPG, something I've not come across. That sounds intriguing to me, at least.


Popping in to say that some MMOs have game marriages, like Maplestory (yes yes, snicker now, I won't blame you). Most of the time it's just a money making scheme though. You would not believe the kind of cash people would willingly haul out for a digital marriage ceremony with a few fringe benefits.

But this is awesome. I've been wondering how long it'd take for games to let anybody marry just about anybody, instead of having the usual guy and girl. Just looking at their response makes MMOs look damn good again.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby cwbyrvr » Sat May 7, 20:47 2011

I went to a couple RP weddings in WoW, they were always kind of boring though. Not an official thing in the game, mind you, just people role playing.

Also I have since gotten pissed enough with problems with DAO that I uninstalled it and plan to pirate it once I get over having to play through the parts I had already played through. The game was rarely playable due to failures with their anti-piracy methods. I think I just got really unlucky, though, I've seen plenty of people say they've played the game since it came out and never came across the issue. Still dunno about DA2 but now I've heard the game isn't that great overall... what did you think of the trial, Rowan?

(Being this has been revived I may or may not be trying to keep things relevant beyond sharing my boring WoW story.)
spacefem wrote:incidently, hearing "i love you" doesn't count if you're naked. it's just too easy to love a naked person.

RD wrote:My armpits are the only area of my body that almost always stays clean-shaven, because if I let it go I feel like a 15-year-old boy trying to grow a beard. In my armpits.
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby SakuraSong » Sun May 8, 3:04 2011

Ahhh, shoot, I totally have not noticed that this was seven days old. :brain: :lightning:

I have a friend who plays DA2 who's really obsessed over it right now, she has a facebook feed on it every other minute. Depending on Rowan's answer, we should all play en masse. :D
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby rowan » Sun May 8, 13:45 2011

seriously the semester ate my head so I haven't even tried playing it yet. One more week though! Then.....
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Re: Straight gamer told to "get over it"

Postby SakuraSong » Sun May 22, 19:25 2011

Totally irrelevant, but I too am waiting for the semester to end so I can play my video games. DAMN YOU COLLEGE. DAMN YOU.
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