Male Castration in Movies

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Dragonrider » Thu Dec 16, 14:47 2010

monk wrote:
Dragonrider wrote:I don't believe these movies are misandrist. The reason is because (according to IMDb) every single one of those movies you listed are written and directed by men. I think it's hardly reasonable to blame women for movies that are entirely under the creative control of men.
Wait a second. Are you saying that a movie can't be misogynist if it's entirely under the creative control of women then?

I would say the result needs to be judged on it's own merits regardless of who created it behind the scenes.
Sorry, I was unclear. The specific nuance I was getting at was that my interpretation of the original post (which could be wrong) was blaming women for this 'trend in movies' (e.g. by relating it to feminism). I was just pointing out that his movie examples are all made by men; indeed, most screenwriting and direction done in the film industry today is done by men.
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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by BeautifulFlower85 » Fri Dec 17, 4:25 2010

Dragonrider wrote: I don't believe these movies are misandrist. The reason is because (according to IMDb) every single one of those movies you listed are written and directed by men.
Well, that's an irrational conclusion.

Both men and women can create misandrist garbage; and unfoturnately, there are men who buy into the "all white men are privileged and all women are victims" propaganda, which sometimes incites them to create misandrist garbage.
my interpretation of the original post (which could be wrong) was blaming women for this 'trend in movies' (e.g. by relating it to feminism).
Obviously not. I'm not blaming women per se.

I'm blaming the all-women-are-victims-and-all-men-are-stupid-privileged-rapists-so-lets-go-cut-their-balls-off-and-laugh brand of feminism that's prevalent today.

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by BeautifulFlower85 » Fri Dec 17, 4:48 2010

ArtificialAmore wrote: I've seen the movie 'Teeth' and in the first scene where her teeth cut off a penis she is making out with her boyfriend who then forces himself on her, she screams no, he holds her down inside the cave and proceeds to rape her, her body uses her (somewhat unnatural) defense of vagina dentata and chops off his penis.
Setting aside your idea that a woman is justified in cutting off her boyfriend's penis if he raped her (or attempted to rape her), possibly killing him... You might want to re-examine that idea. I don't think men nor women should be punished for murder by being murdered themselves, let alone being murdered or castrated because they raped someone (or attempted to rape someone). That's disgusting.

The movie Teeth is make believe. Meaning, a writer created these events so that they would lead up to men getting their penises cut off. So, the women in these movies may seem justified (and I use that word loosely), but that is only because a writer made it that way. It would be like somebody creating a movie that had women's ovaries being removed, women being penetrated with a chainsaws, or women having their clits removed--but the acts are all done out of revenge by a man because of crimes they committed against him in the beginning of the movie. You wouldn't call such a movie misogynist? You wouldn't think there was something seriously wrong with such a movie? Surely the media would.

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by BeautifulFlower85 » Fri Dec 17, 5:00 2010

Enigma wrote:And we aren't talking about man on man violence are we? You were complaining about violence against men's genitals by women.
Yes, in movies, but there's a lot of this kind of thing going on in real life too, with women cutting their boyfriends/husbands penises off because they caught them cheating, because they allegedly abused them, or for no good reason at all. Some women *gasp* do it because they're not very good people. (I know that's crazy some women aren't good people... some are even... bad people).

A quick Google search got me this:

http://www.thelocal.se/18878/20090416/

"According to the indictment, the couple had decided to meet last spring so the man could retrieve some of his things, the City newspaper reports.

But instead of receiving his belongings, the man found himself with a stun gun pointed at his groin.

“I’m going to castrate you,” said the woman, and fired.

The man managed to lunge backwards at the last instant, however, and thus missed being hit by the weapon's electric shock.

The woman has been charged for illegal weapons possession, attempted assault, illegal threats, and abuse."

Oh, and then there's this:

"On January 29, 2005, in China, a woman, A Ju, cut off her husband A Qing's penis with a pair of scissors and then flushed it down the toilet. The penis was not re attached.[65]
In February 2005, police arrested Anchorage woman Kim Tran for a knife attack which occurred during an argument involving a 44-year-old man that wanted out of their relationship. The penis was retrieved from a toilet where the woman had flushed it down, and it was successfully re-united with its owner.[66]
On April 10, 2005, China, a 37 year old woman cut off the penis of her husband Lu Ping with scissors.[67]
On June 11, 2005, Sichuan province, China, 43 year old Tang Hongying, born in Luojiang County, Deyang, stabbed her lover Lan in the leg, and cut off his penis when he tried to escape with a knife. She threw the penis into the garbage. He died of his injuries. Tang was sentenced to life in prison.[68]
On June 30, 2005, Fuqing, China, a 31 year old woman Mou Mou cut off her husband Yu Yang's penis with a kitchen knife. Over 12 hours passed before the penis was found, so no reattachment occurred.[69]
On July 15, 2005, in China, a 30 year old man had his penis cut off by his wife. The penis was reattached.[70]
On July 21, 2005, Zhenjiang, China, 41 year old Yang Xuemei cut off her 44 year old husband Gu Ming's penis and then flushing it into the toilet, aftet knocking his teeth out and blinding him. The couple had a 15 year old daughter.[71][72]
On July 27, 2005, Hangzhou, China, a woman cut off her 27 year old boyfriend's penis with a razor blade.[73]
On September 20, 2005, the first successful penis transplant was begun in a military hospital in Guangzhou, China. A 44-year-old man had sustained an injury that severed his penis in an accident. Despite atrophy of blood vessels and nerves after a protracted period of time had elapsed, the arteries, veins, nerves and the Corpus spongiosum penis were successfully matched. After seven hours' surgery, the penis regained its function and even managed to attain erection. The extent to which the penis' function was restored and occurrence of rejection or infection remain to be seen.[74]
In 2005, A Thai woman cut off her husband's penis after he asked her to make love one more time before he left her for another woman. Saithong Wantha, 53, then asked neighbours to take Udom Phorit, 35, to hospital while she turned herself in to police, reports The Nation. Neighbours got hold of Udom's sister, Boonsong Ansanghan, but they could not find the severed organ. They had to call Saithong on her mobile phone. She told them she had tossed it behind the fence in the front yard. Nearly two hours went by before surgeons at Khon Kaen University's Srinakharin Hospital could operate. Finally, they reattached Udom's penis, but said there was only a 50-50 chance it would function properly.[75]
In January 2006, Kampong Cham province, Cambodia, a Cambodian man Khay Kaing, 40 received 25 stitches to his penis after his wife attempted to sever the organ with scissors after a domestic dispute. An argument ensued and he allegedly slapped his wife. As the man got into bed his wife came at him with the scissors and attempted to cut off his penis, the newspaper reported, not detailing whether she succeeded.[76]
In 2006 in China, a Kaohsiung County woman bludgeoned her husband and cut off his penis on June 11, 2006, according to local media reports. The 62 year-old woman, surnamed Pan (潘), struck her husband, surnamed Li (李), with a pick as he sat on their couch passed out from a bout of drinking, the Liberty Times reported. Li was reportedly unconscious when Pan then sliced off his penis with a razor blade and flushed the organ down the toilet. Li later died at a hospital from severe head injuries, and Pan is in police custody. Pan claimed that she had suffered years of physical abuse at the hands of her husband, who she also suspected of having an affair.[77]
On May 21, 2006, in Luzhou, Sichuan, China, Huang cut off her husband Shi Mou's penis, he then died in the hospital.[78]
On June 12, 2006, Hong Kong, China, a domestic helper sliced around the cirumference of a 5 month old boy's penis. The child was had emergency surgery to its penis in order to stop the bleeding from it and to repair the damage.[79]
On July 19, 2006, in Shenyang, China, a man cut off his own penis after an argument with his wife.[80][81]
On August 5, 2006, China, a woman cut off her ex husband's penis.[82]
On September 2, 2006, in Shanghai, China, a man surnamed Lin from Sichuan, 43 years old, had his penis burnt by radiation treatment at a hospital. the dead tissue was removed, and he was left with a 1 cm stump. He was told he had prostate cancer, it was found that he did not have it after his penis was treated with radiation. It was reported he was unable to have sexual relations with his wife after this, and he received 729,000 yuan (US$91,600).[83]
On September 16, 2006, Shifang, Deyang, China, a woman Yefang (a pseudonym) cut off her 35 year old husband Wei Jian's penis with a knife, then committed suicide by drinking pesticide. The penis was not reattached, the couple had a daughter.[84]
In October 2, 2006, in Harbin, China a woman cut off the penis of her boyfriend 24 year old Hu Mou. The penis was reattached.[85]
In October 6, 2006 Nanjing, China Li Gengbao's penis was cut off by his wife Yao Fengfang because she believed he was cheating on her. After hearing Li Gengbao plead for his penis back, the wife threw it out the window where the neighbor's dog ate it. The wife was given a three-year suspended sentence after her husband asked the judge to be lenient.[86][87]
On November 16, 2006,in Yangzhou, China, Zhou had his penis cut off by his ex wife when he refused to remarry her. He lost sexual function in the penis. Video of Zhou and Ex wife who severed his penis[88]
In March 2007, in Ipoh, Malaysia, two one month old twin Chinese boys had their penises and testicles cut off by their 4 year old sister with a pair of scissors. The penises were cut off at the root. The penises and testicle were re attached except for one testes that could not be found. Ipoh is a majority Chinese city in Malaysia.[89]
On August 2, 2007, in Ca Mau province of Vietnam a woman used a 20 cm knife to cut off the penis of her husband BT Hai, 44, and throw it in a ditch near the house. The hospital could not reattach the penis.[86][90]
On April 22, 2007, a man cut off his penis with a knife in a packed London restaurant.[91]
On April 10, 2007, in Xili Nanshan District, Shenzhen, China, a 24 year old woman Wang, from Xinyang, Henan province, cut off the penis of her 20 year old boyfriend, surnamed Yi who was from Hunan, after tying him up, with scissors. She flushed the penis down the toilet. The couple had one daughter born in 2002. Since the penis could not be found, there was no reattachment operation. She had bought rope and scissors the day before and threatened him with knives. He was tightly bound with ropes, and she completely severed his penis at the roots. She did it because she found pictures of other girls on his cellphone. Yi had surgery to restore urination, but with his penis cut off, he was permanently sexually disabled and can no longer have children. Wang was given a light punishment of 5 years in prison.[92]
In October, 2007, China, Wang Youxiang's penis was completely cut off by his wife. IT was reattached at a hospital.[93]
On January 17, 2008, in Jinshui District, Zhengzhou city, Henan province, China, a woman bound her husband's hand and feet with nylon rope while he slept, using scissors to cut off his penis at the root. He begged her to untie him and take him to the hospital.[94]
On February 22, 2008, Lijiang, Yunnan province China, Ye Moumou cut off her boyfriend Zhang's penis with a fruit knife.[95]
On March 11, 2008, Mouyu of Zhangzhou City, China, chopped off her husband's penis while he slept. Her husband Peng Wang confessed to her that he was having sexual intercourse with other women after Mouyu discovered text messages on his cell phone. After her husband fell asleep that night, Mouyu took a kitchen knife and sliced off her husband's penis. Afterwards, she gave the severed penis to their 6 year old son as a warning of being unfaithful.[96]
On April 24, 2008, a Pakistani woman in Lahore, Pakistan, chopped off her lover's penis after he wedded his cousin in a marriage arranged by his parents, The man, 24-year-old Muhammad Shehzad, began a relationship with a 30-year-old married woman named Jamila after they met at a zoo in the eastern city of Lahore two years ago, police officer Asghar Bhatti said. "Shehzad had promised he would marry Jamila if she got a divorce from her husband, but he married his cousin two weeks ago," Bhatti said, adding that this "infuriated her and she decided to take revenge. She invited him to her house last Wednesday and after serving some intoxicant cut off his sexual organ." Police arrested the woman and she remains in custody, Bhatti said. Doctor Sanaullah, who treated Shehzad at Lahore General Hospital, said they have been unable to reattach the penis. "He has become impotent for the rest of his life and will be unable to perform his conjugal duties. He can never become a father," the doctor said. She got out on March 12, 2009 [97][98]
Adelaide, South Australia. In 2008 Ragini Narayan set first to her husband's penis (Satish Narayan) as she had discovered that he was having an affair. Narayan did not intend to kill her husband, she only wanted to scar his penis so that no other woman would want it. Murder charges against Ragini Narayan have been dropped and she is currently facing manslaughter charges.
On May 22, 2008, in Guangxi, China, a woman cut off her husband's penis with a knife. They were married with a son and a daughter.[99]
On July 14, 2008, Yueqing, Zhejiang province in China, Lin Zi's wife severed his penis with a knife, and surrendered the police two hours later. A bloody knife was found in the refrigerator, and a trail of blood led to the toilet, leading police to conclude that the penis was flushed down the toilet. Lin was 36 years old. Most of the penis was severed, leaving only the scrotum.[100][101]
On July 13, 2008, A woman in Yueqing, Zhejiang province, China, cut off her husband's penis following an altercation over his fidelity, was sentenced to 13 years in jail, and ordered to pay her husband 168975.9 yuan. The woman, Hu, frequently fought with her husband Nan, whom she often accused of having an affair with another woman. In the early hours of July 13, when Nan was fast asleep, Hu severed his penis with a kitchen knife and immediately surrendered to the police. She threw away the penis, cleaned the knife, and after wrapping it in plastic bags, placed it into the refrigerator. She then called her lawyers, then left their daughter more than 94,000 yuan. Their daughter was 7 years old. Hu had a history of mental illness, according to their family. The penis could not be found, and Nan had surgery to urinate successfully, but failed to reconstruct the penis.[102]
On July 21, 2008, in Nanjing, China, it was reported that several wives cut off their husband's penis because they could not stand that their husbands were gambling or cheating on them. These are classified as a "crime of impulsion" by prosecutors in Nanjing, because the women go through an "emotional crisis". Most of these female criminals were younger than 35, and receive only a suspended sentence or one below three years, and are sent back home.[103]
On July 22, 2008, in Zhengzhou, China, a Chinese woman, An Hua, cut off her husband Zhang Yang's penis with scissors. When she learned that zhang had an affair, she gave hima yoghurt drink laced with sleeping pills, and tied his hands and feet to the bed before cutting off his penis. She was sentenced to 10 years in prison.[104]
September 2, 2008 in China, Wang Hui, 28 years old, had his penis severed by his wife after she gave him a drink of wine. They were married for 5 years, with a 5 year old daughter.[105]
In October 8, 2008, in Suixi County, Guangdong China, a 25 year old woman, Huang, cut off her 29 year old boyfriend Luomou's penis with a fruit knife. She threw the penis into a sugarcane field.[106]
In October 20, 2008, in China, a 7 year old boy, Xiao Yang had his penis partially cut by a woman.[107]
October 20, 2008, A 12 year old boy was admitted to a Chengdu hospital with head injuries and a severed penis earlier that year.[108][109]
On November 15, 2008, in China, Guangdong province, a 30 year old woman, Ruan Roudan cut off the penis of a 4 year old Chinese boy, surnamed Xiao. Ruan did it because Xiao's father, Xiao Ming had fired her from her job, and kicked her out after having an affair with her, and she wanted him to die without an heir. Xiao bled until his penis was re attached at the Guangdong Provincial People's Hospital. Whether it would affect future sexual functions is unknown. Ruan was from Guangyuan in Sichuan province.[110][111][112]
In 2009, A 68 year old mentally unsound man had difficulty passing urine, so he cut off his penis, Nanyang Siang Pau and China Press reported. The man only identified as Yap, later underwent a corrective surgery after family members rushed him to the hospital in Ipoh. The doctors could not re-attach the severed part. He was in stable condition although he continued to have fever.[113]
On February 6, 2009, in China, Dongguan, Guangdong province, Xie Lin had sex with her husband Lin, then cut off his entire penis with scissors. He was sent to Dongguan People's Hospital, and the penis was not re attached. He is forced to squat when urinating , and suffered from pain, urethral contraction, and itchiness. He and his wife had 3 children.[114][115]
On April 13, 2009, Huangjiang, Dongguan, China, a 39 year old man, A Zhi, had his penis cut off by his girlfriend Yang Mou, who was 6 years older than him. They had been together for 6 months. She had told him before "If you are a playboy, I will cut you." The penis was reattched at the hospital.[116]
On April 18, 2009, in Yunnan, China a 42 year old woman Lin severed the penis of a 58 year old man Wang Dayou.[117][118]
On May 2009, in Singapore, A secretary accidentally bit off the penis of her employer while giving him oral sex in a car. On reaching the park, they did not alight from the car. Not long after, the car started to shake violently. After the car was hit by the van, there was a loud scream from the woman whose mouth was covered with blood,' he said. The woman later followed her lover to the hospital with part of the sexual organ.[119]
In May, 2009, Russia, a woman Kira V. attached firecrackers to her boyfriend Alik D's penis after he turned down her offer of marriage after being together for 2 years, saying he would rather return to his ex wife and son. Kira convinced him to stay for a farewell dinner. The two dined together and got to drinking heavily. Alik finally passed out from drinking excessively. After Kira blew up his penis, he was rushed to intensive care in the hospital.[120]
In 2009, in Guangzhou, China, Mrs. Xie cut off her husbands penis after he brought his mistress home and made love in front of her. Angrily, Mrs. Xie waited until her husband had fallen asleep and snipped his penis off while he was sleeping. She 10 years of prison for her crime.ref>"Guangzhou Wife Cuts Off Cheating Husband’s Penis". ChinaCogito news. 2009-07-31. http://chinacogito.com/blogs/4-blog-gen ... ands-penis. Retrieved date= 2009-07-31. </ref>
On August 10, 2009, in Shenzhen, China, 27 year old Yang Xiaomei cut off her husband Tang Mouzhong's penis with a fruit knife. She suspected he had an affair, and drugged his red bull drink. She then took off his shorts, and tied his hands and feet with plastic wire on bed, and tied a blue cord around his neck. Yang then sealed Tang's mouth and nose with white tape. She then sliced his penis off, and strangled him to death. Yang then fled the scene and threw Tang's penis into a ditch by the road. She plead guilty in court. Yang and Tang had 2 children, aged 6 and 2. Yang hoped her in laws would raise 30,000 yuan for the children.[121]* On August 16, 2009, in Nanjing, China, Li Li cut off her husband Zhang Min's penis with a pair of scissors. They were married over 20 years with a 20 year old daughter. Zhang was sent to the Provincial People's Hospital for treatment to reattach the penis.[122]
On August 22, 2009, Wuchang, China, Liu Shifu's penis was cut off by his wife. He was taken to the hospital in time to have it reattached. Liu was 47 years old.[123][124]
On October 9, 2009, A woman severed her husband's penis during his sleep with a pair of scissors about 3 am in their apartment in Shanghai, China on Sanmenzhi Road in Hongkou District. The woman suspected that her 34-year-old husband surnamed Lu was having an affair. He was sent to nearby Changhai Hospital by his wife's sister. His penis was stitched up. The couple came from Guizhou Province and the wife was said to have some mental problems, according to her mother.[125]
On November 1, 2009, in Yiwu, Zhejiang, China, a 30 year old man, known by the pseudonym A Song, had his penis cut off by his 30 year old extramarital girlfriend with scissors. He had a wife and daughter, and his girlfriend also had a family. His penis was reattached at a hospital.[126]
In 2009, Trabzon, Turkey a 39 year old Turkish woman cut off the penis off her 28 year old lover and threw it on the roof of a neighboring building. Surgeons worked for 11 hours to re-attach the penis in an operation which they described as successful, and said full sexual function should return within six months. She claimed she did it because he "had broken his promise to marry her and forced her into prostitution and beat her".[127]
On January , 2010, in Luohu District, Shenzhen, China, a woman from Hunan, surnamed Huang, poured sulfuric acid over the penis of her boyfriend Chen who was from Henan. She was 47 years old, born in 1963, her boyfriend was 29, 18 years younger than her.[128][129][130]
On May 9, 2010, in Kaifeng, China, a 38 year old woman named Zhang cut off her husband Lee's penis. They had a 9 year old son.[131]
On May 30, 2010, Wenzhou, China, a 35 year old man, Wei had his penis cut off with scissors by his wife. It was reattached.[132]
On August 23, 2010, in Ho Chi Minh City Vietnam, a man had his penis reattached after his wife cut it off with a fruit knife.[133]"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ca ... is_removal
If you can find me a straight man sexually attacked and murdered by another man that would also fit my criteria.
Um, men are murdered, assaulted, burglarized, and mugged every day by men and women everyday. In fact, all of the aforementioned happens more to men than to women here in the US.

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by BeautifulFlower85 » Fri Dec 17, 5:15 2010

Sonic# wrote: It seems you poorly understand what precisely goes into making men stronger.
I wrote that men are in principle stronger than women. You claimed otherwise, which is baffling. And the primary reason why men are stronger than women is because they have more testosterone. In other words, a normal healthy woman who exercises regularly is weaker than a normal healthy man who exercises regularly. Why? Because men have more testosterone.

To believe otherwise is to deny reality, and I hope there's at least 1 honest woman on this board who will agree with me on this...
Yet another contradiction. You don't know how I feel. So you cannot claim that I am desensitized.
No, this would be called common sense. When you're circumcised your glands are forever exposed, which desensitizes them over time (and since you were circumcised as a baby a lot of time has passed). If you still had your foreskin, then yours glands wouldn't be exposed as often.

And this point is separate from the point I made earlier that cutting off a part of a defenseless baby's (who can't say yes or no) penis is disgusting and backward.

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Sonic# » Fri Dec 17, 8:42 2010

I wrote that men are in principle stronger than women. You claimed otherwise, which is baffling. And the primary reason why men are stronger than women is because they have more testosterone. In other words, a normal healthy woman who exercises regularly is weaker than a normal healthy man who exercises regularly. Why? Because men have more testosterone.

To believe otherwise is to deny reality, and I hope there's at least 1 honest woman on this board who will agree with me on this...
I wrote that men are in principle stronger than women. You claim I said otherwise, which is baffling, since I said, "It seems you poorly understand what precisely goes into making men stronger. There are a lot of hormones besides testosterone that produce strength, for instance." The issue is that you didn't specify a measure of strength. If you're going for the average ability to lift weight, yes, men are stronger. Depending on the measure though, sometimes women are stronger and more vigorous. The composite picture I was trying to produce was that such differences in strength are not significant to how men or women should be treated, nor are they summable into a "principle of strength" simpliciter.

To believe otherwise is to deny the nuances of reality, and I hope there's at least one troll on this board who will agree with me on this...
Yet another contradiction. You don't know how I feel. So you cannot claim that I am desensitized.
No, this would be called common sense. When you're circumcised your glands are forever exposed, which desensitizes them over time (and since you were circumcised as a baby a lot of time has passed). If you still had your foreskin, then yours glands wouldn't be exposed as often.
No, this would be called common sense. When I was circumcised my glans (not glands - ew) is more exposed, but you assume that exposure implies desensitivity. If the nerves worked as bits of old machinery, only rubbing down, then you might have a point. But nerves are biological, and as such have feedback mechanisms that can protect from such desensitization. You also poorly qualify what is overstimulation. Settled in my boxers probably doesn't count. I don't lose sensation in my hands as a result of overstimulation. Why my penis?

Exhibit 1: http://www.cirp.org/library/sex_function/masood1/
Results wrote:Seventy-four percent of patients had no change in their libido levels, 69% noticed less pain during intercourse (p ! 0.05), and 44% of the patients (p = 0.04) and 38% of the partners (p = 0.02) thought the penis appearance improved after circumcision. Penile sensation improved after circumcision in 38% (p = 0.01) but got worse in 18%, with the remainder having no change. Overall satisfaction was 61%.
Sensation is sometimes worse after circumcision. You will find several studies that come to that conclusion, along with several studies that observe no difference, or a benefit in sensation. So your "common sense" is here misapplied.

It's further misapplied because you cannot judge how my body feels.

And this point is separate from the point I made earlier that cutting off a part of a defenseless baby's (who can't say yes or no) penis is disgusting and backward.
I've never challenged you on that. I've just claimed that my circumcision has not adversely effected me, and that, whereas the benefits and drawbacks of male circumcision are still unclear, the drawbacks of female circumcision are well understood and, thus, we respond more strongly against it.

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Enigma » Fri Dec 17, 10:01 2010

BeautifulFlower85 wrote:
Enigma wrote:And we aren't talking about man on man violence are we? You were complaining about violence against men's genitals by women.
Yes, in movies, but there's a lot of this kind of thing going on in real life too, with women cutting their boyfriends/husbands penises off because they caught them cheating, because they allegedly abused them, or for no good reason at all. Some women *gasp* do it because they're not very good people. (I know that's crazy some women aren't good people... some are even... bad people).
--examples--
If you can find me a straight man sexually attacked and murdered by another man that would also fit my criteria.
Um, men are murdered, assaulted, burglarized, and mugged every day by men and women everyday. In fact, all of the aforementioned happens more to men than to women here in the US.
It seems to me that 99% of those examples are in china. So while I'm sure it sucks to be those men I think you're missing my point. I was asking for examples relevant to the day to day life of the average north american male.

And yes I know all women aren't nice people. lol. I'm not an idiot. I know that women attack men. But you still haven't disproved my main point, which is that women in our society are way more likely to be attacked or sexually violated by men than men are by women. Aka - power dynamic.
"Human beings are amazing... we might be horrible, horrible, but we're wonderful too. Otherwise, why go on?"

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by monkeypoop » Fri Dec 17, 15:02 2010

BeautifulFlower85 wrote:I'm blaming the all-women-are-victims-and-all-men-are-stupid-privileged-rapists-so-lets-go-cut-their-balls-off-and-laugh brand of feminism that's prevalent today.

uh, that's not feminism. I've also never met anyone with that ideology... not to say that just because I haven't witnessed or experienced something personally means it doesn't exist, but I question your claim that it's really prevalent in today's society. you posted a handful of movies, some of which don't even support your claim, and that's hardly a good indication of the widespread views of society. you also don't take into account that the media exaggerates and distorts things and is not an accurate representation of real life, because some people will go to any extremes to make a few bucks. personally, I've seen several of the movies used as examples simply because I heard they were ridiculous and/or shocking and wanted to see what they were all about, which is a pretty good marketing strategy. that doesn't mean I think they're good, wholesome films, or that I agree with what is portrayed in them. controversy sells. I would argue many of the movies that have been posted in this thread were created with that very idea in mind.

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by DWH » Fri Dec 17, 19:32 2010

WARNING: I may have linked TVTropes several times to save my sanity.

Also, I don't think that examples from a horror film are going to hold a lot of water. The entire point of the genre is to, in some way, HORRIFY you. I think a vagina with teeth biting off a man's penis is supposed to be invoking Crosses the Line Twice, but it can definitely read as Dude Not Funny. As with most things in entertainment, Your Mileage May Vary.

Fact is that characters from any gender can be Stuffed Into the Fridge, though the particular crimes you're worried about here happen much more frequently to women than men in fiction (particularly in comics) and in reality.

So, how about this- drop the gender association and say, hey, let's just NOT CUT OFF ANYONE'S GENITALS. I don't think there's a mass castration epidemic (China might have some problems there, but China also has some serious women's rights problems, so if they could work on those, their castration issues might decrease dramatically). No feminist I have ever met has been pro-castration, so I'm not sure why you're convinced this is some sort of common idea in feminism.

That said, I'm going to go read some Crowning Moments of Heartwarming to return my brain to a happy place.
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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by monk » Fri Dec 17, 20:23 2010

I would just like to point out that cutting off a man's penis is not castration. Castration is cutting off his testicles. And yes it does seem like China has a problem, but I think the problem is that women are tired of being treated like shit and some few are starting to respond (and maybe overreact a bit) to several thousand years of mistreatment.
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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by The Other Lizard » Sat Dec 18, 11:47 2010

monk wrote:I would just like to point out that cutting off a man's penis is not castration. Castration is cutting off his testicles. And yes it does seem like China has a problem, but I think the problem is that women are tired of being treated like shit and some few are starting to respond (and maybe overreact a bit) to several thousand years of mistreatment.
I'd just like to point out that it's probably not a good idea to generalize about Chinese women "being treated like shit". In some ways, China has more gender equality than north america does. It's a very diverse country in terms of gender roles.

I think the reasons that it happens more in a particular country is probably beyond the knowledge of anyone on this forum. If I was actually trying to find out the reasons I would probably go ask an expert in sociology, or do some research at my university's library. If it was happening in North America we could probably speculate about that, but culture plays a huge role, and when we don't know the culture, we don't really have the knowledge to have informed opinions.
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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by newlydiscovered » Sun Dec 19, 18:39 2010

BeautifulFlower85 wrote:
ArtificialAmore wrote: I've seen the movie 'Teeth' and in the first scene where her teeth cut off a penis she is making out with her boyfriend who then forces himself on her, she screams no, he holds her down inside the cave and proceeds to rape her, her body uses her (somewhat unnatural) defense of vagina dentata and chops off his penis.
Setting aside your idea that a woman is justified in cutting off her boyfriend's penis if he raped her (or attempted to rape her), possibly killing him... You might want to re-examine that idea. I don't think men nor women should be punished for murder by being murdered themselves, let alone being murdered or castrated because they raped someone (or attempted to rape someone). That's disgusting.
I have also seen that movie and, to clarify, in that scene the female character (a) was completely unaware that she even had vagina dentata, (b) had no control over/did not deliberately use the teeth she was unaware she had, and (c) was horrified by the whole situation. I hardly think that constitutes revenge/punishment. If you are injured in the process of physically attacking another person, I really don't see how that's anyone's fault but your own.
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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Phenomena » Sat Dec 25, 11:52 2010

BeautifulFlower85 wrote:Regardless, I see this as a way to spin sexism against men into sexism against women. It's yet another example of how deep-rooted misandry is in our culture. It's impossible for people to see men as victims. Your view is not that people see women (and children) as more valuable than men (women and children first!), it's that women are seen as weak. Imagine what would happen if every time somebody mentioned an example of sexism against women, a person would chime in and spin it to look like it's really men who are being wronged and what's happening is a byproduct of that. Of course, that never happens... that kind of thing only happens to men, case in point this thread. And one last thing: the explanatory power of the reason "women are seen as weak which is why violence against them is seen as wrong" is deficient in that it doesn't get to the heart of the matter. It doesn't follow from this reason that women are more valuable than men. In fact, you'd think women would be seen as less valuable than men if they were just thought of as physically weaker and that was that. However, that's not the case... People seem to value a woman's life over a man's (women and children first). Men are seen as disposable, as you put it. Apparently, there is some deep-rooted belief that women are better than men--not at moving heavy things and fighting wars--but that they're intrinsically more valuable, like how most people believe a human being is intrinsically more valuable than a cow.
I don't think women and children have to be first because their life is considered more valuable and the fact that people are just as touched by a murder case that involves a man getting killed by a woman as the opposite (from what i have seen) does prove that sex is not a factor when people are determining the value of somebody's life. I think It's just because men are seen as the protectors, they should be the ones to save everyone, as their superior physical strength (and i'm generalizing here) makes them more apt to fulfill this task (just like it's a parent's responsibility to protect their child. Women and children are seen as fragile and thus defenseless, which is, btw, exactly why children are given the priority too, along with women).

Saying this is not spinning sexism against men into sexism against women, it's just saying that when there is sexism against one sex, there is sexism against the other too (men are indeed not all super strong protectors, but women aren't all weak and defenseless children either).
BeautifulFlower85 wrote: You make good points, but I can't help but think that you're not addressing the elephant in the room. That violence against men is usually depicted as funny or justfied, and violence against women is usually seen as flat-out wrong (as it should be). This kind of mindset also holds the implication that women are more valuable than men. This all falls under the category of sexism against men or misandry.
The word "misandry" seems to be used too lightly nowadays. I would consider this misandristic if people actually did hate men and thought men's pain was funny because of this. It does however not seem to be the case (but here again, i'm solely basing this argument on what i have personally experienced). As long as men's gender role won't change in society, it just makes sense to me that their pain will be considered funnier than that of a woman. Why? Because expressing pain is associated with weakness, weakness is associated with femininity and men acting like women is considered funny. This also explains why it is so hard for most of us to see men as victims ("men are (supposed to be) strong, victims are (supposed to be) weak => men can't be victims"), unless the man is assaulted by another man, because here the strength is (assumed to be) equal. That is sexism, but not misandry, and, to me, that difference of treatment is yet another one of the many negative consequences our current gender roles have, both for women and men.
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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by s1thl0rd » Sat Jan 15, 2:48 2011

Why is it OK for a guy (like myself) to be circumcised, yet it is "genital mutilation" when a knife is taken to a woman's genitals?

Now I'm not saying I support what they do to these girls, but it's interesting to see the dichotomy in our society.

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Mathmo » Sat Jan 15, 5:28 2011

s1thl0rd wrote:Why is it OK for a guy (like myself) to be circumcised, yet it is "genital mutilation" when a knife is taken to a woman's genitals?

Now I'm not saying I support what they do to these girls, but it's interesting to see the dichotomy in our society.
The acts which are described as "circumcision" and the acts that are described as "female circumcision", despite having similar names, are not comparable.

If we ask questions like:
- after this surgery, will this person be able to have penetrative sex without pain?
- could this surgery make this person unable to urinate without pain/discomfort?
- does this surgery ever have beneficial medical effects on a person?

then it becomes clear that there is a real difference. (And that's without considering pain at time of procedure / shock / infection / open sores / need for later surgeries, because I don't know much about those, but I think you would again find that FGM is much more harmful than circumcision.)

There are various procedures that fall under 'FGM'. From the World Health Organisation website http://www.who.int/mediacentre/factsheets/fs241/en/:
Female genital mutilation is classified into four major types.

* Clitoridectomy: partial or total removal of the clitoris (a small, sensitive and erectile part of the female genitals) and, in very rare cases, only the prepuce (the fold of skin surrounding the clitoris).
* Excision: partial or total removal of the clitoris and the labia minora, with or without excision of the labia majora (the labia are "the lips" that surround the vagina).
* Infibulation: narrowing of the vaginal opening through the creation of a covering seal. The seal is formed by cutting and repositioning the inner, or outer, labia, with or without removal of the clitoris.
* Other: all other harmful procedures to the female genitalia for non-medical purposes, e.g. pricking, piercing, incising, scraping and cauterizing the genital area.
The reason that FGM is described as mutilation is not because 'there is something sharp going near ladybits which are somehow more sacred than manbits' (after all, people get the weirdest things pierced, for example ...) but because - well - it is. e.g. one definition of mutilation - "Mutilation or maiming is an act or physical injury that degrades the appearance or function of any living body, usually without causing death." - FGM (in any form) definitely does degrade the function of the vagina and I think much more than circumcision could be argued to mess with the function of the penis.

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by The Other Lizard » Sat Jan 15, 17:07 2011

To be fair, though, there are also those that argue that male circumcision is also a rights violation.
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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Aum » Sat Jan 15, 19:20 2011

I'm not really liking the equivocation I see here about circumcision. Yeah, female circumcision is arguably more brutal, but male circumcision is not exactly sunshine and roses either. A lot of circumcisions are done improperly, or too tight, affecting sexual function later. Because it is a cultural norm, it has infiltrated the medical establishment at the highest levels, including the UN. The UN policy on AIDS in Africa now is circumcision for men. Meanwhile, the benefits are negligible and it creates the false confidence that one is protected from STDs by having the foreskin removed.

Circumcision came from the Abrahamic faiths. It was one's covenant with God, a.k.a promising to not masturbate. Masturbation is more difficult without a foreskin. Men still do it, but at risk to the glans if they don't use lubrication. Many circumcised men suffer injury over the course of their lives to the glands because they lack the function of the protective foreskin. The glans itself becomes hardened with a keratinized layer of tissue that wouldn't be there if the foreskin were protecting it. There is nothing natural about male circumcision, but it is so fashionable in places like North America that people are actually embarrassed or repulsed by the sight of an uncircumcised penis -- they aren't even used to what a natural penis should look like, that's how twisted it is. I have had this debate so many times, and the same people always show up calling me out as a quack, even doctors! They say it looks better. They say they wouldn't want their boy to feel embarrassed in the change room at school by having a foreskin. They argue for social acceptance. They state flimsy medical benefits. They'll say anything to justify damaging the penises of newborn babies.

And the brit milah? Sucking the blood out of a penis that you just cut open? That is perverted. If anyone else did that, they would be charged with assault and molestation. But it's okay if a rabbi does it? I don't fucking care what your religious beliefs are. It's appalling. Yet we attack people for their beliefs in Africa about female circumcision, a "tradition" that has existed there for a very, very long time. So their tradition is not okay, but ours is? The hypocrisy never ends.

I'm not really interested in the equivocations. Foreskin removal is mutilation. It affects sexual function, it is done without consent at birth, and it serves no huge benefit. Unless your foreskin is to tight that your quality of life is going down or you are genuinely getting routine infections despite all your attempts at proper hygiene (which is rare), there is no reason to get one. All of the justifications are just for cultural norms. The same goes for seeing clips of men getting kicked in the balls as comic relief. It fucking hurts... it is excruciating, yet this kind of violence against men is funny. I ask why?

As I said in another thread, men have not had a revolution yet. Penises are still viewed with disgust by many, especially if they do not conform to the ideal penis. In North America, that's a cut penis... a porn cock, if you will. It's gross and cruel. I've heard feminists complain that women have to bare all on t.v. but we never see anything of the guy. I look at it with reverse cynicism... we never see penises, like ever. They are viewed with shame. They are dirty. Although women are being objectified on television, at least they can be seen. And heaven forbid we show an erect penis on t.v... the sky would just fall, even though all those men out there watching the softcore porn on t.v. are beating off with theirs as they watch it.
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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Mathmo » Sun Jan 16, 12:06 2011

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that male circumcision is okay - I do think it is also a violation of rights. I suppose I haven't heard as much about it - thanks for pointing out the stuff you did in your post, Xinzang. I guess I am under the impression (and this may be wrong) that FGM is more of a mutilation than male circumcision, but you're right, that doesn't mean that circumcision is acceptable (certainly not without informed adult consent).

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Sonic# » Sun Jan 16, 12:33 2011

I'm not really interested in the equivocations. Foreskin removal is mutilation. It affects sexual function, it is done without consent at birth, and it serves no huge benefit.
I agree with your reasoning in reference to restricting its future practice, but (as I previously stated) I have trouble when statements about circumcision are so blunt and contrary to my own experiences with circumcision. I don't feel mutilated. I don't feel like my sexual function has been adversely affected. It was done without my consent, but I hold no grudge and feel no harm has come of that. Some people have been hurt by it, and I don't plan on having my kids circumcised, but don't argue that every circumcised person is a victim.

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Aum » Sun Jan 16, 13:29 2011

Sonic# wrote:I agree with your reasoning in reference to restricting its future practice, but (as I previously stated) I have trouble when statements about circumcision are so blunt and contrary to my own experiences with circumcision. I don't feel mutilated. I don't feel like my sexual function has been adversely affected. It was done without my consent, but I hold no grudge and feel no harm has come of that. Some people have been hurt by it, and I don't plan on having my kids circumcised, but don't argue that every circumcised person is a victim.
Not trying to argue that those with circumcision are victims. One could easily go there but it serves no purpose to those who live with it in the aftermath.

You are functional, but you don't know what it's like to have a foreskin. If you had it, and then had it removed as an adult, you would know what you have lost.

My point is that it's largely a cosmetic procedure supported by religious origins that has grown part of mainstream culture in North America. Its medical benefits are overstated and it's not a necessary procedure.
Mathmo wrote:Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that male circumcision is okay - I do think it is also a violation of rights. I suppose I haven't heard as much about it - thanks for pointing out the stuff you did in your post, Xinzang. I guess I am under the impression (and this may be wrong) that FGM is more of a mutilation than male circumcision, but you're right, that doesn't mean that circumcision is acceptable (certainly not without informed adult consent).
FGM is more severe, especially because it involves direct damage or even amputation of the clitoris, and/or sewing the vagina partially shut. (Depends on who is doing it and what their requirements are.) The equivalent in men would be removing the glans altogether.
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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Sonic# » Sun Jan 16, 18:24 2011

I originally thought to send this as a PM as I may be quibbling over details, but I think we're still being civil, and other people may have input here too.
Xinzang wrote: You are functional, but you don't know what it's like to have a foreskin. If you had it, and then had it removed as an adult, you would know what you have lost.
The way you've said this is quite useful, because I realize that what I'm feeling, and what I'm going to say in response, will sound quite strange. What follows is my exploration of that non-intuitive statement.

I haven't lost anything.

We can agree to disagree on this, but I think it is more accurate for you to say, "If you had it, and then had it removed as an adult, you would know whether you have lost something." As it is, there's no way for me to know that I've lost anything. To my perceptions, to my sexual identity, to what I understand, I am not missing anything that other people have, and notice no difference between myself and my uncircumcised friends save the foreskin itself and the reactions to our penises. And even that's funny, because we've both felt scorn as a result of our equipage; some partners prefer uncircumcised, and others circumcised.

I know you're not calling me a victim, but you and others (not here, but elsewhere) have implied that as a result of my circumcision I am in some way disabled, that I have lost some function I would otherwise have. It is even more frustrating to be distrusted when I say I don't miss it, and in response for others to claim that I would miss it, if only I knew I had lost it.

This isn't even the case of having come to terms with a traumatic event. It's a case of reconciling the discourse opposed to the general act of circumcision, which correctly points out that it has few benefits and potential risks, and my own experience of it, where the circumcision isn't an event I ever think about except when I'm made to feel self-conscious about it. I don't think everyone loses something as a result of male circumcision. I think that when something is lost, in many cases it is not significant enough to cause concern. (Note that there are still many cases where male circumcision is a problem, and I in no way belittle those cases. If an individual thinks its a problem for them, then it is.) In cases like mine, I don't think we need to speculate about what may have been lost, since that is unknowable, in order to address the larger practice of circumcision. Additionally, the tendency to overscrutinize the circumcised body for any sign of malfunction makes me feel uncomfortable because it takes away the option of determining what my personal functionalities and malfunctions are.

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Storage and Disposal » Sun Mar 6, 17:14 2011

Is it a good sign that this guy had to go back as far as a 2 month old post in order to find something he could disagree with? I think so.
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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by Sonic# » Sun Mar 6, 17:43 2011

^ Yeah, agreed.

I also like that the poster disregarded what I was claiming, and also the evidence I used to claim it.

Keep it rational.

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Re: Male Castration in Movies

Post by helium » Sun Mar 6, 18:01 2011

Name-calling, reviving a dead thread, post is totally off-topic... I'm gonna pull this one out again.
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