Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

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Endymion

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Thu Jun 20, 7:10 2019

I like ideas, behavior, stories and people who go against gender norms. That’s one reason why I am so interested in finding out about women in history. Warrior women are another such case.

To start with are the Greek myths of the Amazons. In myth the Amazons were strong aggressive women who always lost against the Greek males. However, recently there has been some archeology evidence that the Amazons were not completely a myth. There have been discoveries in tombs, in the area where the myths say the Amazons lived (around the Black Sea) of women warriors with weapons and even war wounds, although they did not live in an all female society. This article from National Geographic contains an interview with Adrienne Mayor who wrote the book The Amazons: Lives and Legends of Warrior Women across the Ancient World, published in 2014. In the interview she states “Archaeologist have been digging up thousands of graves of people called Scythians by the Greeks. They turn out to be people whose women fought, hunted, rode horses, used bows and arrows, just like the men.” And that “The great equalizer for those peoples was the domestication of horses and the invention of horse riding, followed by the perfection of the Scythian bow, which is smaller and very powerful. If you think about it, a woman on a horse with a bow, trained since childhood, can be just as fast and as deadly as a boy or man.” DNA testing has been able to determine that many of the buried warriors where women. The Scythians lived in Asia between the Black Sea and Mongolia. See here for the National Geographic article: https://news.nationalgeographic.com/new ... -cannabis/ and also here for an article from the Smithsonian: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/ ... 180950188/. Connected with this is the theory that trousers were invented by horse riders living in this same area, so women may have been among the first to wear trousers.

The following information is from “The True Story of Grace O’Malley, Ireland’s Pirate Queen” by Anne Chambers. Born in 1530 in Ireland, Granuaile (Grace O’Malley) was a real Pirate Queen and had as many as 20 galleys in her fleet. A galley, such as she would have commanded, was a wooden vessel, powered by as many as 30 oars and one sail. They could sail in swallow waters without grounding which was a great advantage in that Granuaile could hid her ships in the many inlets which pocketed the northwestern coast of Ireland (page 10). Sometime after 1560 she went to live in a “tower-castle” on Clare Island, in Clew Bay in what is now County Mayo and commanded a force of two hundred men (pages 51 to 54). According to legend she gave birth to one of her three sons while at sea on a ship she captained and joined in its defense the very next day, as it was vital that her men could see their leader with them (pages 67 and 68). Granuaile was a Pirate Queen for over forty years (page 36) during which time she met with Queen Elizabeth in the summer and early fall of 1593 (page 125). Here is a video showing Mairead Nesbitt of Celtic Woman performing a piece of music called Granuaile’s Dance on the violin, while she dances to her own music, 4 minutes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-ttrQ38mOc. She makes me think of a pixie or fairy in the way she moves. Also here is a link to an article entitled “9 Female Pirates you Should Know” by Krisaty Puchko. The nine are: Anne Bonny (b. c. 1698 in Ireland), Mary Read (b. c. 1695 in England), Sadie the goat (b. 19th century, New York), Queen Teuta of Illyria (b. 3rd century BCE in Balkan Peninsular), Jacquotte Delahaye (b. 17th century, Haiti), Jeanne de Clisson (b. c. 1300, in Brittany France), Anne Dieu-Le-Veut (b. mid 17th century in Brittany France), Sayyida al Hurra (b. c. 1500, Morocco) and Ching Shih (b. c 1775 in China): http://mentalfloss.com/article/58889/9- ... hould-know.

In 1942 the 588th Night Bomber Regiment was formed in the Soviet Union to help fight the German invasion which had begun the year before. This regiment was unique in that all of the pilots were women. These female pilots had volunteered and flew slow, canvas covered bi-planes similar to those used in the First World War, 24 years before. They were not women who happened to find themselves in combat, but their purpose was to be in combat. The uses of these types of bombers mean that the women could generally reach their targets undetected. They would then switch off their engines and glide to where they would release their bombs. The first sign the German troops had of these attacks was a swish sound just before the bombs struck. These female bomber pilots were nicknamed Nachthexen or Night Witches. The pilots of the 588th Regiment dropped more than 23,000 tons of bombs, many times making more than one fight a night. They never used radios nor had parachutes. The parachutes would not have been of much use since they flew so low. I saw a Russian made miniseries about these women, but was disappointed in that the female pilots seemed to be just put there to be a romantic interest for the male soldiers. Based on its trailer an earlier Soviet made movie seems better. See here (3 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Os7T0mO7eS4. This link goes to a short animated film about Nadezhda Popova, one of the pilots. The film is by Alison Klayman: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lI3uwt8RU10.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

Endymion

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Mon Jun 24, 10:56 2019

While I have written about many “Women in history” I have not written about the second half of the title of this topic – “an examination of gender norms.” Well here I will correct that.

A simple definition of the term “norms” is something that is normal (usual, typical, or standard). These norms may involve relatively frivolous matters, such as fashions and types of music people like or they could involve much more serious things such as sexism and racism. It seems clear to me that many social or cultural norms do change over time, but in many cases change tends to be gradual, although the rate of change may vary and even reverse at times and this suggests to me two things. First that these social and cultural norms are not solely the result of inborn human nature or there would be no change or a change that is much slower than that which is seen. Second, for the norms that change gradually the changes are not solely the result of rational, logical and conscious thinking or the changes would be much faster than is seen. That is I believe that changes in these norms are in part, but a significant part, due to changes in the way people feel on an unconscious level about things, in terms of how they feel about what is right and wrong, what is good or not good, what is pleasant or distasteful and what is true or false etc. and not solely due to how people rationally, logically and consciously think about those things, although there could be relatively quick changes that are due mostly to logical decision making. Further there could be cases where the change appears to be rapid, such as the ratification of the 19th amendment, but that came about only because of a gradual development of support for it, which took many women working very hard over years and even after its ratification women were and are still not as likely to be elected. There does seem to be other such cases where change appears to be quick, but the quick change was preceded by a gradual development of support for it. Also, there could be changes that were caused by an overwhelming force.

So, based on the above existing norms (beliefs and feelings) which motivate various behaviors can be a result of “Nature” meaning what a person is born with and “Nurture” a person’s experiences after they are born. This is not an either or situation, but in my opinion it is a result of the interacting of nature and nurture, so one person may be influenced in a different way to a particular experience as compared to how a second person may be influenced by that same experience. Further these norms (beliefs and feelings) which motivate certain behaviors may be logical meaning that a person has consciously decided to act a certain way or the motivations can be the result of how a person unconsciously feels – feelings that come about spontaneously without conscious thought or a combination of both. The way I see it humans are not computers. Generally if one puts information into a computer it is fully there in a binary manner and entering it a second time will not make any difference. However, people are not like that. Generally it takes repeated efforts for a person to learn something (gain information or a skill), meaning that it takes practice. In regard to norms (beliefs and feelings) about what is right or wrong, good or bad, pleasant or disagreeable etc. being exposed to something different will not necessarily immediately erase the prior beliefs and feelings, although the new experience could add something and it is possible that repeats of those new experiences will tend to reduce the effects of the prior ones. So, based on this to various degrees norms (beliefs and feelings) can be thought of as being conscious or unconscious or some combination in between. To the extent that they are unconscious they take longer to change. However, if change is quick that would suggest they were conscious beliefs.

By extension a simple definition of the term “Gender Norms” is something that is normal (usual, typical, or standard) for one gender, but is not normal (usual, typical, or standard) for another gender. So, if norms could be a result of a combination of Nature, conscious Nurture and unconscious Nurture then gender norms could also be. Based on the concept of unconscious
Nurture if a girl or boy experiences women being mainly concerned about the home and family and their beauty and men being mainly concerned with the public and being the breadwinners then they may unconsciously, without thinking too much about it, assume that those roles are just natural. They could unconsciously associate leadership qualities with men and not with women then that could affect their beliefs and feelings, meaning that they may unconsciously believe and feel that men make better leaders. This process would form unconscious gender norms. If as these girls and boys grow up they follow those “learned” gender norms this could then result in the next generations of girls and boys making the same connections. However, this is not 100%. Every now and then we could have people going against these connections, for example women taking on more active public roles and there being more writing and talk about how women are as capable as men in regard to these public roles then girls and boys will have more opportunities to connect and associate women with activities outside of the home. So, the gender norms that women’s place is in the home and men’s is in the public sphere will lessen. This is what we see happening. That is unconscious nurture could explain the gradual change in gender norms that we can observe, for example the Gallup Polls on whether a person would vote for a woman president which slowly increased and the slow increase of the number of elected women.

Now some may write that they disagree with me, which is fine and appropriate for an “examination of gender norms.” In this way the reader can judge for herself what is most correct or may come up with a third possibility. On the other hand some may agree and I would like to hear from them also.

Tom,

To be continued.
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

Endymion

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Jun 30, 16:21 2019

Earlier I presented data on the increase in the number of women elected to the US Congress. This post will be about the increase in the US female Civilian Labor Force Participation Rate (CLFPR) and the percentage of graduates from US schools who are female. If anyone has such data from their own nation I encourage then to write about it. The Civilian Labor Force Participation Rate is determined by dividing the civilian labor force by the adult population, with the labor force being the number of adults employed plus the number of adults unemployed. In this regard a person is unemployed if they are not working for pay, but is actively searching for employment. So, the CLFPR shows the percentage of the civilian adult population who are either employed or who are actively looking for employment.

According to the Federal Reserve Bank of St. Louis the CLFPR for women was 32.7% in 1948. It tended to increase until it peaked at 60.0% in 1999 and then declined somewhat to 57.1% by 2018. This same figure for men was 86.6% in 1948. It then tended to decrease and in 2018 was 69.1%. The net result was that the female participation in the labor force was 53.9 percentage points lower than that for males in 1948 and this gap narrowed to 12.0 percentage points by 2018. Thus this gap in percentage points was 4.5 times smaller in 2018 than in 1948.

The following information is from the First Measured Century as presented on a PBS website:

Labor Force Participation of Women (https://www.pbs.org/fmc/book/2work8.htm):
Single Widowed, Divorced or Separated Married, Married with Children < 6
1900 44% 33% 6% 12% (1950)
1996 or 98 69% 49% 61% 64%

So the biggest change was for married women. Note that the married with children < 6 series only began in 1950.

Attitudes toward Marred Women Working (https://www.pbs.org/fmc/book/2work9.htm):
1936 18% approved vs. 82% disapproved
1996 83% approved vs. 17% disapproved

Female Physicians: 1900 6% vs. 1998 26%
Female Lawyers: 1900 1% vs. 1998 29%
Engineers: 1900 0.01% vs. 1998 11%
This shows large gains in the percentage of women in each of these professional occupations.
https://www.pbs.org/fmc/book/2work11.htm

Gender Balance of Graduates, percent of persons with that degree who are women: (https://www.pbs.org/fmc/book/3education2.htm):
High School Bachelor’s Masters Doctorates
1900 60% 19% 19% 6%
1997 or 2000 51% 56% 55% 41%

Interesting is that there were significantly more women receiving High School diplomas in 1900 than men, but significantly more men receiving higher level degrees than women. It seems that if a man was to complete high school he were more likely to go in school than a woman who completed High School.

According to an article by Anne Strych of Bizwomen website, in 2016 women earned 53% of doctoral degrees and “. . . 2017 was the ninth year in a row that women earned the majority of doctoral degrees at U.S. universities.” See here: https://www.bizjournals.com/bizwomen/ne ... grees.html

Further the article reported that “The CGS/GRE Graduate Enrollment & Degrees: 2007-2017 report also found that in fall 2017, the majority of first-time graduate students at all degree levels were women — 59.2 percent at the master’s degree and certificate level, and 53.5 percent at the doctoral level.”

The above shows additional examples of gradual change.

However, women did not do as well in all fields as the following chart based on information from the Bizwomen article shows:

Percentage of Doctoral degrees awarded by broad field and gender in the US 2016-17

Public Administration and Services 75.6
Health Sciences 70.3%
Education 68.8
Social and Behavioral Sciences 61.1
Arts and Humanities 53.2
Biological and Agricultural Sciences 52.6
Other fields 52.4
Business 48.9
Physical and Earth Sciences 34.1
Mathematics and Computer Sciences 25.1
Engineering 23.4

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

Endymion

Posts: 85
Joined: Wed Dec 20, 0:03 2017
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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Jul 7, 15:06 2019

Is there such a thing as visual Male Beauty?

I have written about how even now, based on the data presented, that women are underrepresented in many public endeavors – government, art, films, music and literature. And that it appears that there are significantly fewer stories which are primarily about women or girls in film and at least in what are considered the top books. An exception is in regard to dance, in that it seems there are many more female professional dancers than males, although there is data which suggests there are more men choreographers than women. As to there being more female dancers than male dancers I wrote “Well some might say that there are more female dancers because females are more beautiful than men. While I would agree that more people in much of the world experience females to be more beautiful than males, I do not feel that females are inherently more beautiful than males. However, I am going to leave a discussion on this for a future post.” Well here is that future post.

In my opinion visual beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. That is there is no subjective measurement of beauty. One person may experience one thing as very beautiful and another person may experience that same thing as ugly. This does not mean that one of those people is incorrect. In my opinion how a person feels about visual beauty can be a result of what they are born with (nature), but also their experiences after their birth (nurture). Therefore, I feel that the culture one lives in can influence a person’s perception of visual beauty. This seems to me to fit into the realm of gender norms, to the extent that it is normal for people to think of females and in particular women’s bodies to be more visually attractive and more likely to be beautiful, than those of males. However, this does not mean that it is natural for people to feel that way.

Currently it does seem to me that art nudes are mostly of women rather than men, but that was not always the case. During the classical Geek period (approximately 500 BCE to 326 BCE) almost all if not all large statures of the nude were of the male nude. Then between the end of the Roman Empire and the beginning of the Renaissance there were almost no nudes particularly large nudes, either female or male. Interest in the nude revived during the Renaissance with the discovery of classical Roman copies of Greek statues. It appears to me that this revival involved male and female nudes, perhaps more male the first statue in the round of a nude since the end of the Roman Empire was Donatello’s David (c. 1440 to c. 1460). Most nude produced during this a period were of historical, mythological or religious subjects. Starting in the mid 19th century, perhaps with Manet’s “Dejeuner sur l’Herbe” (1862), it became more common to place the nude, particularly the female nude, in a modern setting. With this is seems to me that the female nude began to dominate. This change in how dominate the female or the male nude was in art at different periods suggest to me cultural inference.

Here are examples of the male nude in art that I see as beautiful. They are all by male artists. Nudes including male nudes done by female artists can be seen in the “Female Artists and the Nude” topic. I purposely choose each of the below works to be fully nude without censorship so as to avoid any notion of shame:

One of my favorite works of art is Michelangelo’s “David” (1501 to 1504). The statue is large, 16 feet, 11.15 inches tall, weighs 12,478.12 pounds (more than six tons) and is carved from Carrara Marble. I feel this is a beautiful work of art and that the model would have had a beautiful body. To me David’s face shows supreme confidence and concentration. He knows what he wants and he is certain that he will achieve it. Also in his expression I see intelligence. His body shows the same confidence. The figure’s weight is on one leg as if he is prepared to move forward. He is ready for action and is not tense. His physic shows a young man who is fit and powerful, but also who could be agile. Despite the strength indicated I sense that his more powerful quality is his intelligence such as is revealed by his eyes. His hair is slightly long and wild. If I had to use just one word to describe my impression of this figure the word would be “noble.” Michelangelo depicted “David” completely nude. Despite that the young man’s nipples, penis and testis are clearly shown there is no shame about this figure. Nothing is hidden – everything is there to be seen. For me this heightens the feeling of confidence and nobility that I see in the figure. He is not ashamed of any of his attributes and I don’t feel he needs to be. I don’t feel that Michelangelo thought of this work to be of the David of the Bible. The statue shows a young man, perhaps 18, but in the Bible David is too young to go to war, he is described as being little more than a boy. In 1504 this image of a giant fully nude male was placed in the Piazza della Signoria, in the heart of the city of Florence and in front of the Palazzo Vecchio. A place of honor where it could easily been seen.

This link shows David in the Accademia Gallery in Florence. It is narrated (2 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_G0bT_Tuth4.

Next is a link showing the David being restored. Narrated by Karine, the restorer is named Cinzia Parnigoni. I included this one because it clearly shows the size of the work (4 ½ minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsrKhGI9uow.

Neither of the above videos shows the back of the statue so here is a link to an image of the back: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... ngelo2.jpg.

Here is a short video from the Danish Royal Cast Collection showing Donatello’s David and narrated by Maria Haras (2 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sj54WRAAxYY.

If you are interested here is a longer (7 ½ minute) video showing the bronze David in Florence and narrated by Beth Harris and Steven Zucker: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6kUUJJV_MNA.

Next is Auguste Rodin’s “The Age of Bronze” (1877) (1 ½ minutes, no narration) this version is not in bronze: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KEzLkmJ0hco.

Now we come to a short 19 second long video showing what appears to be a computer generated “3D model of the Apollo Belvedere:” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4G1TmGTozSw.

And here is the same work from the Danish Royal Cast Collection narrated by Maria Haras (2 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3Vl11a_pa8.

Lastly, for the time being anyway, here is a painting, Girodet’s “The Sleep of Endymion” (1791) (3 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2B68DWcOLj0, Narrated by Beth Harris and Steven Zucker. As noted in the topic “Female Artists and the Nude” the myths differ as to the name of the goddess and who put Endymion to sleep, but fundamentally they are about a female goddess who is visually attracted to a mortal male and visits him nightly – an active female and a passive male.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

Endymion

Posts: 85
Joined: Wed Dec 20, 0:03 2017
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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Jul 14, 14:09 2019

This post will deal with three female artists, with the first not being as well known as the next two. She is Virginia Sterrett who was born in 1900 in Chicago. While a teenager she received a scholarship to the Art Institute of Chicago and then obtained employment illustrating advertisements. At the age of 19 she was paid a total of $750 for illustrating a book of “Old French Fairy Tales” by Sophie Comptesse de Segur. Two years later she illustrated Nathaniel Hawthorne’s book of “Tanglewood Tales.” The third book that Virginia illustrated was “Arabian Nights.” Here is a 3 minute long video with music of Virginia Sterrett’s illustrations along with her portrait shown near the beginning: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jY9nGUgilvI. This video is by Christiane Santiago.

I like Virginia Sterrett’s images and see fragileness in many of them, not just the pictures themselves, but also in the people depicted in them. Many of the artist’s color illustrations can be found at this link: https://artsycraftsy.com/sterrett_prints.html. Click on any of the books’ names to see the illustrations from that book.

The second is the photographer Dorothea Lange who was born in Hoboken, New Jersey in 1895 and who, as a child, became sick with polio. She has been quoted as stating that “[polio] was the most important thing that happened to me, and formed me, guided me, instructed me, helped me, and humiliated me.” Growing into adulthood she studied photography for a short period at Columbia University and then moved to San Francisco. During the depression and the Dustbowl disasters of the 1930’s and while she was working for the Resettlement Administration and the Farm security Administration Dorothea made some of her most moving images. In 1942, which was after the depression, Dorothea Lange took pictures of the many American citizens of Japanese descent and others of Japanese descent who were living in the United States and who after the US entered the Second World War were interned in camps as a result of President Franklin Roosevelt’s Executive Order 9066.

The following photograph, by Dorothea Lange is called Migrant Mother (1936) and is perhaps her most famous photo. It is of Florence Thompson age 32 at the time and an out of work pea picker with seven children.

Image

Here is a quote by the artist regarding her picture of Florence Thomson:
“I saw and approached the hungry and desperate mother, as if drawn by a magnet. I do not remember how I explained my presence or my camera to her, but I do remember she asked me no questions. I made five exposures, working closer and closer from the same direction.

And here is a photograph of Dorothea Lange (1936):

Image

The following link goes to a ten minute long video with music show many of the artist’s photographs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fw1AZkvdC8k.

The works of the third artist, Georgia O’Keeffe, are not just about flowers. She was born in Wisconsin in 1887 and traveled extensively throughout the United States. At the age of 28 she produced a number of charcoal abstractions. Then starting in the 1920’s Georgia O’Keeffe began to move away from pure abstraction, but her paintings still kept the general feel of that form. She did this with her pictures of flowers by zooming into her subject to show them as they are not normally seen and thereby made for herself a new motif. When in New York she produced some urban paintings, then she moved to New Mexico and began her series depicting the landscapes of that area. I feel Georgia O’Keeffe was an innovative artist who produced many beautiful pictures. Many of her works are of identifiable subjects, but with a distinct abstract quality with an amount of energy I would have not expected from a still life.

To show Georgia O’Keeffe’s range here is a video, with music of 294 of her works. Very nice, but it is 28 minutes long. I would suggest finding a place to relax while viewing it. Perhaps come back latter: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMJuclT7lnw.

If you want something shorter here is a 3 minute video with music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2q-9kEl_Pek. At the end is a picture of the artist holding one of her works.

I would like to see all of these artists receive more attention than they currently do, in particular Dorothea Lange and Georgia O’Keeffe. Due to the quality of their work and the innovation shown those images I feel they deserve it.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

Endymion

Posts: 85
Joined: Wed Dec 20, 0:03 2017
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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Jul 21, 13:38 2019

For a while I have been thinking about doing a post on women in science and other related fields, well here it is.

Maria Sibylla Merian was both a scientist and an artist. Her art was the method she used to show her science. She was born in 1647, in the city of Frankfurt in what is now Germany. At an early age she started to study insects, by collect them and depicting them in paintings or drawings. Her first publication of these images was in 1677. In 1699 she and her daughter, Dorothea Maria, went to Surinam in South America for two years to draw the local flora and fauna as well as to collect samples. Over the next five years she produced copperplate engravings which were used for a book entitled Metamorphosis Insectorum Surinamensium in 1705. Her original pictures are now in England.

Here is a video slideshow, with music, of her engravings (11 ½ minutes):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sCfOQF0nAXo.

The neuroscientist Dr. Marian Diamond was born in Glendale, California in 1926. She was instrumental in demonstrated that due to environmental factors the physical structure of the brain could be altered after birth. During the 1960s she found that the abilities of rats to successfully run a maze depended on the environment the rats were raised in. Rats which were kept alone in small cages did poorer as compared to rats which were kept in larger cages with other rates and with interesting items such as balls and ramps. More importantly she also found that the rats kept in the larger, more populated and more interesting cages had thicker cerebral cortices compared to the other rats. That is the size of the cerebral cortices wasn’t only determined by what a rat was born with (nature), but also what the rat experienced after birth (nurture). Marian Diamond stated that “Our results have shown at least five factors which are important for a health brain according to our research: Diet, exercise, challenge, newness, and love.”

Here is a 4 minute long video in which Dr. Diamond talks about her experiments: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0APJD-wN7MA.

A film of Dr. Marian Diamond’s work and life entitled “My Love Affair with the Brain” was produced. Here is a short (6 minute) trailer for that film: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIB1v0pLhNM.

Hidden Figures is a 2016 film based on the true life story of three African-American women who were crucial to the early Space program in the United States. The real life women this story was based on are Katherine G. Johnson, a mathematician, born in West Virginia in 1918, Dorothy Vaughan, also a mathematician, born in Kansas City in 1910 and Mary Jackson, a mathematician and aerospace engineer, born in Hampton, Virginia in 1921. Here is an article from Essence magazine showing pictures of those three women and revealing 8 Facts: https://www.essence.com/holidays/black- ... res-facts/.

In the movie Katherine G. Johnson was portrayed by Taraji P. Henson (b. 1970 in Washington DC), Dorothy Vaughan by Octavia Spencer (b. 1972 in Montgomery, Alabama) and Mary Jackson by Janelle Monae (b. 1985 in Kansas City, Kansas). Here is a video of the three actresses talking with Katie Couric about the real women in this story (5 ½ minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OK-HQZtjouc. Margot Lee Shetterly (b. 1969 in Hampton, Virginia) wrote the book the movie was based on.

Hedy Lamarr, born Hedwig Eva Maria Kiesler in Vienna Austria, in 1913, is known as an actress of the 1930s and 1940s, but she also was an inventor. In 1942, she helped invent, along with the composer George Antheil, the “Secret Communications System” also called the “Frequency-hopping Spread-Spectrum System.” Basically the radio sender and receiver would each have set in them identical changes in frequency at identical times so that when the sender changed frequency the receiver would “know” what frequency to “hop to.” Hedy may have had a stronger personal reason than most for wanting to defeat the Nazis as she was born a Jew.

Here is a link to names of 19 female inventers including Hedy Lamarr: http://www.women-inventors.com/Women-Inventors.asp.

Perhaps the best known female scientist is the physicist Marie Curie, born Maria Sklodowska, in Warsaw in 1867. Early in her life she was involved in a student revolutionary group. Afterwards she attended the Sorbonne in Paris having moved to that city in 1891. Marie Curie received two Nobel prizes, the first in 1903 for Physics and the second in 1911 for Chemistry. She was the first person, man or woman, to win two Nobel Prizes. In 1935, Marie Curie’s daughter, Irene Joliot-Curie (b. 1897) won a Nobel Prize in Chemistry.

Tom,

To be continued

I encourage others who know of interesting women in history to add to this topic.
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

Endymion

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Jul 28, 12:23 2019

Can a male dancer be beautiful?

The word beautiful is not just used for females as one might speak of a beautiful tree, a beautiful sunset, a beautiful flower, etc., but very rarely does anyone speak of a beautiful man. Further, I see the word beautiful as being more intense that the word handsome. In this post I will examine the gender norm of not referring to a man as being visually beautiful. To put it another way is there such a thing as visual beauty regarding the male body? I encourage others to comment as to their thoughts on this. Videos of male dancers which emphasize the visual aspects of their bodies will be linked to here, but these men will be at least partly clothed.

My guess is that many people think and feel that the costumes worn by male ballet dancers are strange and I would agree that those costumes are unlike what is normally worn by men. I can also see how they would be considered strange as compared to the gender norms for male apparel, at least in the culture that I am most familiar with. But that is not only what these videos will show. They will also show the gracefulness and the degree of expression exhibited by these men.

The most common piece of attire worn by male ballet dancers are tights. While these dancers are not nude wearing tights allows the form (the outline) of the lower body to be shown and it seems to me that is the primary purpose of wearing tights. That is tights are worn to better show the dancers leg movements and the leg and the gluteal muscles. Female dancers also wear tights however unlike the male dancers the lower parts of the trunk of their bodies are generally more covered. When I first started watching ballet regularly about 25 years ago, I was somewhat uncomfortable watching the male dancers, however over time and having seen and enjoyed many ballets, mostly recorded, but many live, I gotten much more comfortable with that to the point where I consider many of these male dancers to be visually beautiful. It seems to me that my discomfort got in the way of my experiencing these men to be beautiful. Here is a quote I found which refers to this idea: “Both male and female dancers wear tights causing a variety of responses (especially for the men in tights) ranging from it being okay and esthetically pleasing to snickers and giggles.” It is by Karen Kain, Artistic Director of the National Ballet of Canada, see here: https://national.ballet.ca/NBOC/media/M ... tights.pdf.

The next link goes to a video (8 minutes) of dancers, both male and female, of the Mariinsky Ballet performing the Waltz of the Flowers from Tchaikovsky’s “The Nutcracker” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOC36Qjug4U.

“Le Spectre de la rose” is a short ballet approximately ten minutes long. It involves two dancers, one male and one female and particularly highlights the dancing and abilities of the male dancer. The early 19th century poem it was inspired by is from the point of view of the rose but the ballet is from the point of view of the young woman who, after coming home from a ball, falls asleep and dreams of the rose represented by the male dancer, so the dancer is a figment of her dream. See here (10 1/2 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64Cq9RvTPYU. I don’t know the names of the dancers as the credits appear to be in Russian. The male dancer in this not only wears a tight full body leotard, but is particularly graceful and expressional, in a way that seems to me to be counter to male gender norms. In addition he is dressed in pink and decorated with flowers, as well as wearing a flower covered cap. These are some things that I like about the ballet. Another is the male dancer’s very athletic abilities, particularly as to his leaps.

As I mentioned before male ballet dancers do not always wear tights, to some degree it depends on the ballet. In the ballet “Le Corsire” the dancer who portraits Ali traditionally wears loose Turkish type pants, while his chest is bare and in the ballet “La Bayadere,” Solor, the principal male dancer, also wears looser pants. On the other hand some male dancers wear very little. Such is the case in the Diana and Acteon pas de deux.

This 13 ½ minute video shows 13 versions of the male variation from the Diana and Acteon pas de deux. This dance has a somewhat complicated history. Originally it was called Diana and Endymion. Then in the early 20th century it was made part of another ballet and was given its current name. Actually it doesn’t fit the Diana and Acteon myth very well. Further, as I explained in two other topics, the original myth involved Selena and Endymion. See here for the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8n7jFk9P5Tc.

The next three links go to videos of dance that are not ballet. This first one is called “Ostrich” and is performed by a dancer from the Alvin Ailey Dance Theater (3 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwwqA4iCV60. As with the ballets I feel that this dancer goes against gender norms for males in this culture, not only by showing so much of his body, but by his gracefulness, his expressions and his costume of colorful feathers.

Most people would not associate the next type of dance with men. It is pole dancing. This video shows Carlos de Brasil performing in the “Miss Pole Argentina” contest in the male category. What impresses me about this video is the dancer’s strength, being able to support himself perpendicular to the pole and the expressive quality of his dance and the music (3 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FerVRgeDido.

Finally here is Josh and Sharna’s freestyle dance from the show “Dancing with the Stars.” Unusually in this dance the male performer wears less than the female performer (5 1/2 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hV6Qw6RLYFE.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

Endymion

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Aug 4, 10:29 2019

Earlier I wrote about the underrepresentation of females in films, both in regard to the number of actresses and also the number of stories that centered on females. But this seems even worse for older actresses. According to Time Labs study of “over 6,000 actors and actresses” (see here: http://labs.time.com/story/these-charts ... ender-gap/) the number of roles for actresses, over a 5 year period, reaches a peak at approximately 4 roles at age 30, while for actors the number of roles over the same period reaches a peak of over 5 at age 46. At every age after 30 men get more roles than women.

A 2017 study by the USC Annenberg School for Communication and Journalism reports that among the 148 senior characters (age 60 and above) in the 25 films nominated for Best Picture and released in 2014, 2015 and 2016, “77.7% were men and 22.3% were women.” This study was conducted by Dr. Stacy L. Smith and her team. See here: https://annenberg.usc.edu/sites/default ... 0Final.pdf.

An article from The Washington Post (see here: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/won ... 72446e66bc) reports that “. . . economists Robert Fleck and Andrew Hanssen traced Hollywood’s long and enduring problem with ageism.” They used data from IMDb dealing with 1920 to 2011 films. In regard to older actresses and actors, the article reports that “Beyond age 40 over 80 percent of leading roles go to men.” In the article it is noted that “So for both male and female actors, 40 is a critical age. Among male actors, 40 represents the midpoint of their careers –about half of the leading film roles for men go to actors over 40. For women, 40 is a sunset year. When a female actor reaches 40, she loses access to about three-quarters of the leading film roles for women.”

According to the article “Men have always gotten more roles than women. For much of history, men took upwards of three-quarters of film roles. Women have made slight gains recently – but men still claim over 66 percent of film acting jobs.” Also, “The gender imbalance remains when the focus is narrowed to leading roles. If anything, it has gotten worse for women. In the silent film era, men claimed 55 percent of leading roles. These days, men get between 60 to 70 percent of leading roles.” So, based on percentage, while women are getting more roles they are getting fewer leading roles.

This Washington Post article by Stephanie Merry (see here: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/art ... 29aa15af34) gives data on average age of Oscar acting winners going back to the late 1930s. On average best actress winners were 8 years younger than best actor winner (36 to 44) and supporting actress winners were 10 year younger than supporting actor winners (40 to 50). For every 10 year period 1937-46 to 2007-16 the average age for actress winners in either best or supporting categories were younger than the average age for actor winner in those categories except for the first period (1937-46) when supporting actress winners were, on average, 2 years older than supporting actor winners (44 to 42). In the period 2007-16 the figures were 41 years for best actress to 47 for best actor and 37 for supporting actress to 53 for supporting actor. The article also notes that the average age for best actress increase to 41 in the 2007-16 period from 31 in the 1997-2006 period due to wins by Meryl Streep, Julianne Moore and Helen Mirren.

In an article from The Pudding (see here: https://pudding.cool/2017/03/film-dialogue/) there is a graph called “Aging out of Hollywood: Men vs. Women” which shows that actresses aged up to 31 have more dialogue than actors in the same age group, that actresses and actors have the same amount of dialogue in the 32 to 41 age group and actress aged 42 and above have less dialogue than actors in the same age group. Also shown is that across the 2000 films studied, going back to the 1980s, in 307 films (15%) males had 90% or more of the dialog, in 1206 films (60%) males had 60% to 90% of the dialog, in 314 films (16%) the amount of dialog was roughly equal, in 164 films (8%) females had 60% to 90% of the dialog and in 9 films (less than ½ of a percent) females had 90% or more of the dialog. So in 75% of all 2000 films considered males had 60% or more dialog, while in 8% females had 60% or more dialog. The 9 films with 90% or more female dialog in increasing order were 3 women (1977), Agnes of God (1985), Heavenly Creatures (1994), The Help (2011), The Hand that Rocks the Cradle (1992), Martyrs (2008), Precious (2009), Now and Then (1995) and The Descent (2005).

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

Endymion

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Aug 11, 10:02 2019

In the previous post I wrote about the underrepresentation of older actress in movies. However they are not totally absent and the following might be hopeful signs of improvement.

The 2015 film “Hello My Name is Doris” is a romantic comedy with some dramatic moments in it. Sally Field (b. 11/6/46 Pasadena) stars in the film as Doris. This movie was based on a short film “Doris & the Intern” by Laura Terruso who also co-wrote the screen play for the longer movie. Also in the movie is Tyne Daly (b. 2/21/46 Madison WI) as Roz. Both Sally Field and Tyne Daly were 69 at the time of release. Interestingly Max Greenfield who played the male character John opposite to Doris is 34 years younger than Sally Field. This film is a hidden gem and I enjoyed it a lot, but I suspect that not many people heard of it. I feel that Sally Field is an excellent actress and did a great job in this movie. See here for trailer (2 ½ minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L6vBnnryIug. I highly recommend it

Two years later in 2017 the comedy film “Snatched” was released. It co-starred Goldie Hawn (b. 11/21/45 Washington DC) as Linda Middleton and Amy Schumer (b. 6/1/81 NYC) as Emily Middleton. Also in the film is Wanda Sykes (b. 3/7/64 Portsmouth VA) as Ruth. At the time of release Goldie was 72 years old. I always like Goldie Hawn and enjoyed her performance in this movie. It is a funny, silly in some parts, comedy. Not a great movie, but a good one. Here is the trailer (2 ½ minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PsBWnst8f7w

“The Book Club” was released in 2018. It starred Diane Keaton (b. 1/5/46 Los Angeles) as Diane; Jane Fonda (b. 12/21/37 NYC) as Vivian, Candice Bergen (b. 5/9/46 Beverly Hills) as Sharon and the baby of the group Mary Steenburgen (b. 2/8/53 Newport AR) as Carol. The ages of these four actresses at the time of the release of the film varied from 81 for Jane to 65 for Mary, with both Diane and Candice being 72. Interesting three of the four actresses were older than the actor she is paired with. On average the four actresses were 3.5 years older than the four actor. I enjoyed watching the four veteran actresses perform. Here is the trailer (2 ½ minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDxgPIsv6sY.

Most recently, in 2019, the film “Poms” was released. It starred Diane Keaton, who by 2019 was 73. Diane was very good in her role of Martha, as was Jacki Weaver (b. Sydney Australia 5/25/47) in her role as Sheryl. Also in the movie is Rhea Perlman (b. Brooklyn 3/31/48) as Alice. Jacki Weaver was 72 at the time of the release of the movie, while Rhea was only 71. Of the IMDb first billed cast members, 12 out of the 15 are women. I felt the movie started slow, but I would recommend patience as it soon picked up and I enjoyed it. Interestingly when Diane Keaton’s character is asked “Who they would cheer for” she answered “for ourselves” which I think is a major theme of the story. Here is the trailer (3 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sv89kRmoSlg.

Here is a video (4 minutes long) of the real life Sun City Poms. Their members include Patricia Reynolds age 71, Carol Dana choreographer age 73 and Ginger Price age 86. The average age of the members is a little over 70, they do 40 performances a year, and they do splits: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBgVOCxC0rw.

The older female characters in these films are portrayed as having feeling and aspirations just as much as young characters. I also like the camaraderie, closeness and companionship shown between the women in these films. It is unusual for me to see so many women in a film.

The following is not about older actresses, but about actresses on the other end of the age spectrum. As it is recent information I decided to post it here.

A “Dora the Explorer” film entitled “Dora and the Lost City of Gold” was just released. It stars Isabela Moner (b. July 10, 2001 in Cleveland, OH) as the teenage Dora and Madelyn Miranda as the 6 year old Dora. What is noteworthy about this movie is that it seems to be about a teenage female action hero. Here is a trailer for the film (2 ½ minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUTtJjV852c.

Second is the possibility of a female 007 in the next James Bond movie. She may be played by the British actress Lashana Lynch (b. 11/27/87). Here is a one minute long video on Lashana Lynch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbfjrfNhRL0.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

Endymion

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Aug 18, 10:39 2019

Continuing with the idea of older actresses here are links to videos about three Dames:

The first is Dame Judi Dench who was born on December 9, 1934 in North Yorkshire, England. See here for 6 minute long tribute video with music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svRZuxX6cwg.

Her latest film is “All Is True” released in 2018, in which she portrays Ann Hathaway. Judie Dench also has four film is post-production and another entitled “Cats” which is completed and due out at the end of 2019.

Next is Dame Maggie Smith born on December 28, 1934 in Ilford, England. See here for 7 ½ minute long video of the actress’ films: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zP5iu0VhS7c.

She recently portrayed The Dowager Countess, Violet Crawley over five years of Downton Abbey and will again portray the countess in a movie version of Downton Abbey to be released in September 2019. Maggie Smith will also be in a movie “A Boy Called Christmas” which is currently in post-production scheduled to be released in 2020.

The third is the baby of the three Dame Helen Mirren, born on July 26, 1945 in London, England. See here for 1 ½ minute long video of her films: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rsfp7V8Ef-Q.

She currently involved in filming a new movie and is playing the title role in the TV series Catherine the Great, which is in post-production. An animated film in which she is voicing a character and which is in post-production is due out next year and she is in a completed film due out later this year. Catherine the Great is at least the fourth Queen she has portrayed.

This next video (4 minutes long) is entitled “Beautiful Older Women of the World” by Angela G. Gentile. It is not about any one particular person: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QD6L82Ge76I. I’m not saying that all of the women in this video are beautiful, but they are attractive and their faces are interesting and I enjoy watching it now and again.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by melsbells » Wed Aug 21, 16:05 2019

Sorry, I haven't been keeping up well enough to comment timely.
Endymion wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 10:56 2019
It seems clear to me that many social or cultural norms do change over time, but in many cases change tends to be gradual, although the rate of change may vary and even reverse at times and this suggests to me two things. First that these social and cultural norms are not solely the result of inborn human nature or there would be no change or a change that is much slower than that which is seen. Second, for the norms that change gradually the changes are not solely the result of rational, logical and conscious thinking or the changes would be much faster than is seen. That is I believe that changes in these norms are in part, but a significant part, due to changes in the way people feel on an unconscious level about things, in terms of how they feel about what is right and wrong, what is good or not good, what is pleasant or distasteful and what is true or false etc. and not solely due to how people rationally, logically and consciously think about those things, although there could be relatively quick changes that are due mostly to logical decision making. Further there could be cases where the change appears to be rapid, such as the ratification of the 19th amendment, but that came about only because of a gradual development of support for it, which took many women working very hard over years and even after its ratification women were and are still not as likely to be elected. There does seem to be other such cases where change appears to be quick, but the quick change was preceded by a gradual development of support for it. Also, there could be changes that were caused by an overwhelming force.

So, based on the above existing norms (beliefs and feelings) which motivate various behaviors can be a result of “Nature” meaning what a person is born with and “Nurture” a person’s experiences after they are born. This is not an either or situation, but in my opinion it is a result of the interacting of nature and nurture, so one person may be influenced in a different way to a particular experience as compared to how a second person may be influenced by that same experience. Further these norms (beliefs and feelings) which motivate certain behaviors may be logical meaning that a person has consciously decided to act a certain way or the motivations can be the result of how a person unconsciously feels – feelings that come about spontaneously without conscious thought or a combination of both. The way I see it humans are not computers. Generally if one puts information into a computer it is fully there in a binary manner and entering it a second time will not make any difference. However, people are not like that. Generally it takes repeated efforts for a person to learn something (gain information or a skill), meaning that it takes practice. In regard to norms (beliefs and feelings) about what is right or wrong, good or bad, pleasant or disagreeable etc. being exposed to something different will not necessarily immediately erase the prior beliefs and feelings, although the new experience could add something and it is possible that repeats of those new experiences will tend to reduce the effects of the prior ones. So, based on this to various degrees norms (beliefs and feelings) can be thought of as being conscious or unconscious or some combination in between. To the extent that they are unconscious they take longer to change. However, if change is quick that would suggest they were conscious beliefs.
I might characterize what your talking about as a group think vs. individuality based on the way you describe nurture vs. nature. I usually read nature arguments as saying there's a species propensity for something, whereas (if I understood correctly) your talking about a personal propensity.

Backtracking a long way, When you were learning about singers and actors, did you ever come across the notion that performing careers were seen as low, lewd, or sinful, especially for women? I have some fragmented memories of reading about opera singers moving from a low caste with a similar standing to prostitutes to a place of admiration, though still outside of society in a sense. More recently I learned about women excommunicated for being actresses. Maybe I missed you talking about it earlier, but if not, how do you think the change in status may have affected visibility if women in performance industries?

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Fri Aug 23, 14:00 2019

Melsbells, I thank you, very, very much for your very thoughtful and nice reply. I know I used “very” a lot here, but I am very excited about it and I was surprised to see any reply. In regard to nature and nurture you are correct I was writing primarily about a personal propensity. To me the phase “human nature” is about a species propensity in that it is what the average or the most humans are born with, but not all humans may be born with the same things or with the same amount of those things. I think it is important to see that there are variations among people so that is why I think in terms of the individual. So, in writing about nature I do not necessarily mean “human nature.” The same can be applied to nurture. For example it seems to me that humans are born with the ability and even the desire to speak, so that could be considered an example of human nature, but people’s “natural” ability to speak and to learn language could vary. Also, it appears that humans are not born knowing what words to use. Learning what words to use seems to be a result of what I term nurture. That is people learn what words mean as a result of what they experience after they are born and this could result in people living in a particular society speaking the same language. To summarize what I meant in that long statement you quoted is that humans are very complex and that their behaviors, thoughts, feelings, beliefs and even their likes and dislikes are effected and formed by a variety of factors. Also, that in some important cases one may not be fully aware of the factors that formed those behaviors, thoughts, feelings, beliefs and those likes and dislikes for example which foods people like or dislike. Are they born liking or disliking particular foods or are these likes and dislikes a result of what they have experienced or both. To me liking or disliking particular foods is not something a person consciously decides.

In regard to singers and actors this is something that I had not thought of before, but now that you bought it up it has set me thinking. Reading replies like yours help me learn. During Shakespeare’s time females were not allowed to perform, at least in England. It does seem to me that, at least in the 19th century and most likely before, in terms of occupations, almost anything a woman did outside of the home was considered inappropriate. And it was considered, by many, more inappropriate for a female artist to study from and to depict the nude than for a male, which is the reason for the “Female Artist and the Nude” topic. This is something I would like to look more into so thank you for the idea. Also, how do you feel the situation for women in Finland is compared to other nations?

It surprises me that more people have not commented more to this topic, at least in regard to writing about women in history, as Enigma did regarding artists and Storage and Disposal did regarding female singers and as you and Sonic did. I’m sure there are many people out there who know of such women and I would like to hear about them. No one has replied or commented to female artists and the nude.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Sonic# » Sun Aug 25, 10:39 2019

I think, regarding not replying, that it is hard to figure out how to interject in a series of informative pieces. Like, you're collecting examples of women in different pursuits. That's great. I haven't known quite how to respond beyond, "That's great." I don't have firm criticisms beyond what I said last time; many of the women named have been interesting but not on a level I felt qualified to respond.

Also, I've had far less time. I hit the ground running at work, and I come home to be Dad. When my son goes to bed, my partner and I hang out for a while, I play a few games, and I read. I am usually up once a night with my son. Writing posts takes more energy than I've been willing to allot lately. Just know I'm still reading, usually.

Finally, to these latest posts, I can speak just a bit to women's work before the 18th century. In late medieval England, women could be members in several work guilds. In some, membership was granted to wives, widows, and children of male guild members. In the fifteenth through the seventeenth centuries, women's roles in local civic life became more and more restricted, until guilds were entirely patriarchal. Furthermore, given that most labor generally was either in the home or on the farm (peasants worked the land close to home; smithies, brewing, and other production often occurred in the home), there was not the strong stigma against women outside the domestic sphere that would emerge as employment in industries and organizations became more common in the 18th and 19th centuries. Regarding acting and performance, there were occasionally women who performed in late medieval morality plays and cycles. They would have also been extensively involved in the preparation for these performances, and sometimes in giving or taking payment for performances. Katie Normington's book Gender and Medieval Drama (2004) is an excellently researched monograph on the subject.

What happened to these women performers is perhaps similar to what happened to women in other guilds. Competition pushed them out, as guilds monopolized work for the benefit of men against lower-paid women. The post-Wycliff Catholic church and the Protestant movement in England was associated with more moral strictures against many kinds of behavior, including women speaking up in public. By Shakespeare's time, plays were viewed with suspicion by a vanguard of Puritan reformists, who would seize their opportunity to shut down the stage in 1642 (and more definitively in 1647) during the English Civil War. Yes, the reformers thought that dramatic performance was licentious, and they had Jacobean plays like John Ford's Tis Pity She's a Whore and Thomas Kyd's The Spanish Tragedy to prove it (See themes like incest and gratuitous murder). With the Restoration and the ejection of Puritans from power, women became regular performers on the stage. That said, it wasn't precisely that the plays got less licentious (they were very ribald plays), but that the audiences were more accepting of gratuitous humor, and the people who did disapprove of women on the stage had less power to do anything about it. Meanwhile, women continued to be excluded from most other forms of economic work. So Aphra Behn could become an acclaimed playwright and some actresses were positively celebrated, while simultaneously women's public activity became more and more an exception.

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Tue Aug 27, 7:16 2019

Sonic, thank you for the reply. You make a good point about not having the time to reply. I'm in a different situation as I'm retired and my children now have children of their own and the information I have been posting I have been accumulating over a period of time. In fact some of the information I have posted on other websites although I have expanded on it and rewritten it for this one. Also you have commented a number of times, which I appreciated and I certainly don’t feel that anyone should comment more, particularly if they don’t have the spare time like I have. Sometimes I do wonder what readers think about what I write. I imagine that some people think that I am strange and maybe I am, so just a short comment now and then saying a person knew of a women I wrote about or didn't know about her and the same in regard to the data I gave on the underrepresentation of women certain areas would be fine. The rest of your comment was interesting to me and was new information. Particularly your mention of Aphra Behn. I never heard of her before and immediately looked her up to find out more about her. What I found is very interesting and I read her short story "Oroonoko." So I've learned from your comment and to me that is important.

To all, a comment mentioning a woman in history or an example of a gender norm would be welcome.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Sonic# » Wed Aug 28, 18:11 2019

Thanks. I'm glad you enjoyed Oroonoko! I recall liking that short story a lot, but I haven't read it in years. I know her best for her plays; if you had to read just one of her plays, I'd recommend "The Rover." It's quite a romp, and frankly my favorite Restoration comedy written by anyone.

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Sep 1, 12:29 2019

It can be observed that there are many things that one gender does that others tend not to do. This can include the wearing of skirts, the length of a persons hair and the use of makeup. It can also extend into interests, such as preferring ballet to football and the occupations that are entered into. A couple of posts in this topic dealt with the question can a male be beautiful. Other posts to this topic considered how women are underrepresented in various fields of endeavor such as elected offices, art and the film and music industries, but in dance men are underrepresented. These variations could be considered to be under the concept of gender norms in that it is normal for one gender to act or have preferences which are not the same as other genders. The variation that this post will deal is that women are more likely to remove body hair than men are. Here are three videos dealing with this subject:

The first is of a talk by "Emer O'Toole on women, body hair and why she's stopped shaving (11 minutes):" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRS8NkpE8hc. She was born in Galway, Ireland and in 2015 her book "Girls Will Be Girls: Dressing Up, Playing Parts and Daring to Act Differently" was published.

Next is a shorter video (1 minute) entitled "Project Body Hair by Billie." showing women, some of whom have not shaved their legs, underarms and tummy body hair. It seems Billie is a razor company which makes the video somewhat unusual: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4DDpS685iI.

The third video is by Allure and is entitled "Dispelling Beauty Myths: Body Hair." In it are three women talking about the issue of not shaving body hair and showing their hair (6 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PyWel_sm02M. The women are Monica Hernandez, Alexandra Marzella, and Ayqa Khan.

Here are some pictures of Sophia Loren with body hair: https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-zqhQhBkNAtM/ ... t-hair.jpg

I am a man who has a good amount of body hair and have never shaven my underarms or legs and only experimented for a short time shaving part of my chest and shoulders. During all of my years with body hair I have never had a problem.

The point of these videos is not that a person should or should not shave, but that they do what they themselves want to. Some people may feel more comfortable doing one or the other. So, what do people think?

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by melsbells » Tue Sep 3, 15:17 2019

Endymion wrote:
Fri Aug 23, 14:00 2019
Also, how do you feel the situation for women in Finland is compared to other nations?
I'm not originally from Finland, though I've lived here longer than I've been on spacefem. The only place I can personally compare it to is the United States, but since I've lived mostly as an outsider in Finland (meaning my interactions are fairly limited), I'm not sure I can fairly access how the situation for women compares.

I knew before moving that Finland is often cited as being a Feminist utopia of sorts. It did give women full voting rights at the same as men when becoming a country merely one hundred years ago. Women immediately ran and served in government, I think between 10 and 20%. That steadily increased and women currently make up between 40 and 50% of parliament. So at least as far as representation is concerned, things are fairly equal. There's something about early women MP's running on a moral mother platform, supporting patriarchal norms.

As far as the president goes, out of twelve, there's been one woman, Tarja Halonen. The office of president is not particularly powerful anymore, but they are in charge of the military, so it doesn't surprise me that only 1/12 has been women, considering that women were barred from carrying arms except for one occasion during WWII. Lotta Svärd is the women's organization that had women in non-combat military roles. While Finland does still have conscription, it only applies to men and public opinion is currently against conscription of women. Women have been able to volunteer for military service since the 1990's. It's not completely true that women have only been in armed service for the last 30 years. During the civil war, the reds/losing side trained women for combat roles. But people don't talk about the civil war... like there's some sort of silent agreement not to look too closely at those wounds.

Minna Cant is the big name feminist in history. She's responsible for starting the push for maternity and paternity leave, which is another area that Finland really excels. When I was pregnant I was given State sponsored literature about pregnancy and the first year after birth, mostly in Finnish, but one was available translated into English and it very specifically talked about how parenting and housework is an equally shared responsibility in Finland. This line wasn't in the original text, as though only needed to notify foreigners of the standard. Divorce rates are really high between Finns and foreign spouses, even more so if the foreigner is the husband and the Finn is the wife. My take on this discrepancy is that the egalitarian roles in relationships don't always go over well with men from other cultures. And more sadly, that it's not uncommon for the foreign wife to be prized as more subservient than a Finnish wife would be.

Despite all that, there are definitely unequal gender norms. There's still a pay gap, but not as great as the U.S. Both maternity/paternity leave and earned wages being made public might have something to do with that. Some of the inequality present in Finland, I'm tempted to blame on relatively recent and fast paced industrialization as well as globalization. I haven't really followed the argument that industrialization harmed women closely enough to really stand by it, but I am intrigued by it if not also sympathetic to it. But it's always been there. One can look at Finnish folklore in the Kalevala, the national epic, to see how men have historically been regarded as heroes while the role of women has been either wicked witch, mother, or owned.

I'm always curious about roles that reverse over time. The one in Finnish culture that sticks out to me is that women used to heat the sauna. It was a household chore that fell under women's work, but currently it is considered an honored position usually held by the family's patriarch.

I'm sorry that I don't have sources and I hope I haven't made too many mistakes. For now I'm going to bank on the excuse that is in response to "how I feel" about the subject. I'm inclined to wait longer before posting to check myself against sources, but I fear I would then fail to respond at all.

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Thu Sep 5, 12:15 2019

Melsbell thank you for your comment, it has much information that is of interest to me. Forty to 50 percent of parliament being female and even one president being female is good compared to the United States. I don’t remember knowing about the Finish Civil War and I immediately looked it up and so you taught me that. Also I did not know of Minna Cant and I looked to find out about her. The information about divorce rates between Finns and foreign spouses as well as the information on women in the military and that foreign wives are prized as more subservient than a Finnish wife is also interesting. I plan to look up the “Kalevala” since I am interested in that sort of thing and, as you may already suspect, I am very interested in role reversals.

For those who are as unfamiliar with Minna Cant as I was, she was a writer, playwright, businesswoman, teacher, journalist and social activist who was born in 1844. I’m going to see if I can find an English translation of Kauppa-Lopo. Also for those who want to know more about Minna Cant, here are two links: http://www.womenwriters.nl/index.php/Minna_Canth and https://aleksiskivi.tumblr.com/post/691 ... nsson-1844.

So far four people have commented to the topics I started and I thank them. For other readers I have become interested in women’s lives and stories about women for the past 25 years. Let me know of any women you are particularly interested in or may just have heard of. I would appreciate it. You can give information about the woman or just mention her name and then I will try to find out more about her and write about it. Men have been given much more recognition then women have and I want to write about women who deserve recognition. Also no one other than myself as added to “Female artists and the Nude.” Who is going to be the first?

Tom
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sat Sep 7, 8:32 2019

At the end of this paragraph is a link to an article written by Professor Kathryn Hughes entitled "Gender roles in the 19th century." It is on the website connected with the British Library. She points out that during the 19th century women and men increasingly lived in "separate spheres," which were believed to be due to the "natural characteristics" of each sex. In regard to the education of females, Professor Hughes goes on to write: "Some doctors reported that too much study actually had a damaging effect on the ovaries, turning attractive young women into dried-up prunes. Later in the century, when Oxford and Cambridge opened their doors to women, many families refused to let their clever daughters attend for fear that they would make themselves unmarriageable." This is an interesting and informative article and I encourage the viewer to read it. See here: https://www.bl.uk/romantics-and-victori ... th-century. However, I am particularly interested in the mention of a Doctor William Acton.

On page 112 of his 1857 medical text "The Functions and Disorders of the Reproductive Organs" (linked to in the article under 19th century medical views on female sexuality) Acton writes "the majority of women (happily for them) are not very much troubled by sexual feelings of any kind." Also on page 113 he writes: "As a general rule, a modest women seldom desires any sexual gratification for herself. She submits to her husband, but only to please him; and, but for the desire for maternity, would far rather be relieved from his attentions."

It is pointed out, next to the reproductions of these pages that "Although Acton's views are not representative of the whole 19th century population, they nevertheless reflect that sex was seen by many - including medical professionals - as something exclusively enjoyed by men while women, in contrast, passively endured it for the purpose of reproduction only."

Now we come to Dr. Clelia Duel Mosher, who was born in 1863, in Albany, NY. She received her medical degree from Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine in 1900.

The following information is taken from an American Heritage magazine website article written by Kathryn Allamong Jacob (see here: https://www.americanheritage.com/mosher-report). In 1892 Dr. Mosher started what up to that time was an unique study of married women's sexual relations with their husbands. Of the at least 44 women who completed the nine page questionnaire form all but one was born prior to the 1890s and 33 were born prior to 1870. It appears that one of the questions was do they feel desire for sexual intercourse to which 35 out of 44 answered yes. One woman wrote that sex was not only agreeable to her but “usually quite delightful.” Although another woman reported that "the sudden introduction to sex was such a shock that she 'ran away after one month of marriage'." When asked how soon after marriage did they have sex the answers ranged from immediately to one year. Another question was "Do you always have a venereal orgasm?" It is reported that "a few women did not answer and five wrote only 'no,' leaving open the possibility that they occasionally experienced orgasm, thirty-four women indicated that they did experience it." Also reported in the article was the following in regard to the women's orgasm: "Another [woman], referring to differences in reaction time, complained, 'Men have not been properly trained.' For some, failure to reach orgasm was devastating. The woman cognizant of her 'slow reaction' reported, 'When no orgasm, takes days to recover.' Another described the absence of orgasm as 'bad, even disastrous, nervewracking,—unbalancing, if such conditions continued for any length of time.' One woman said its absence was 'depressing and revolting,' and described orgasm, which she almost always reached, as a 'sense of absolute physical harmony.' Others spoke of the 'quiet' and 'calmness' which followed. One woman described it as a 'general sense of well being, contentment, and regard for husband.' 'This is true, Doctor,' she added earnestly.'" Further it is noted in the article that: "Of those who responded, nine believed that intercourse was a necessity for men; thirteen claimed it was a necessity for both sexes; and the remaining fifteen believed it was a necessity to neither. Though a few women felt that reproduction was the only acceptable reason for intercourse, and thirty marked reproduction as the primary purpose, twenty-four women believed firmly that the pleasure exchanged was a worthy purpose in itself. One young wife who checked both pleasure and reproduction said, 'It sweeps you out of everything that is everyday'.” Dr. Mosher's findings were not published during her lifetime.

It seems to me that in many cases our cultural institutions tend to push women's feelings to the side, with more stories in literature and films being about men, with more male singers presenting the male point of view, to more men in government, to more men in the corporate world and the above shows that even happened (based on the article on Acton) with women's sexual feelings. In all of these areas women are now starting to say their feelings are important too.

Originally this post turned out to be longer than I wanted it to be so I cut it in half. The above is the first half and next I plan to post the second half.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Sep 15, 9:10 2019

Continuing from the last post we come to Professor Helen O'Connell of the University of Melbourne, Australia and the discovery of the full clitoris. In this article, written by Melissa Fyfe and entitled "Get chiterate: how a Melbourne doctor is redefining female sexuality" (see here: https://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/health ... 50jvv.html), Dr. O'Connell is described as "Australia's first female urologist" and as "A gifted endoscopic surgeon" as well as the Director of Surgery and Head of Urology at Western Health . . . In Melbourne's west." The article points out that Dr. O'Connell was inspired by a book entitled "A New View of a Woman's Body" that was published by the US Federation of Feminist Women's Health Centres. However the researchers for this book ". . . had no access to dead bodies or dissection rooms, so had to partially rely on old anatomy texts." But Dr. O'Connell had such access and used dissection of cadavers to make her discoveries. Then in 2005 she ". . . confirmed her original research with magnetic resonance (MRI) of 10 living women."

I recommend that people read this whole article as it describes Dr. O'Connell's various discoveries and how she countered many established believes, many if not all incorrectly put forward by male scientists. For example, the article notes that the 1995 edition of Gray's Anatomy said that the clitoris's major nerve supply was 'very small'. But the nerves were actually 'noticeably large'."

Also as part of the article on Dr. O'Connell, Melissa Fyfe writes about the visual artist Sophia Wallace. Sophia Wallace was born in 1978 in Seattle, Washington. In 2012 she produced a work entitled Citeracy, 100 Natural Laws. This large work is composed of 100 bits of information on the clitoris, such as "Few realize the clitoris is like an iceberg, similar in scale to the penis, and comprised of erectile tissue" and "This organ, which exists solely for pleasure and is present in half of all humans (half of all mammals, too), is all but absent in visual representation" and "all bodies are entitled to pleasure, which is fundamental to full citizenship." In short Sophia Wallace is attempting to put a spotlight on female sexual pleasure. See here: https://www.sophiawallace.art/works#/cl ... ural-laws/. She has also produced, along with Sarah Strauss, a large, 43 by 72 by 11 inch, wood, fiberglass, steel and enamel 3D image of the clitoris see here: https://www.sophiawallace.art/works#/adamas/. Also in the article by Melissa Fyfe is a picture of Sophia Wallace with her clitoris statue. It’s a long article and the author speaks about some other interesting women toward the end.

The following link goes to a video of a TEDx talk by Maria Røsok, entitled "The unknown greatness of the clitoris" (7 minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zdbD-ApZeFE. In it she references Dr. Helen O'Connell and highlights the important of foreplay for female organism. I am particularly interested in her noting the similarity of the clitoris and the penis.

So we have gone from a male doctor saying that most women do not enjoy sex, to a female doctor asking women about this and finding that many women do enjoy sex, to another female doctor actually discovering the full clitoris - the female sexual pleasure organ, to a female visual artist promoting the idea of female sexual pleasure, to another female promoting the clitoris and female pleasure in a TED talk. Does there seem to be a pattern here? What do people think about female sexual pleasure being part of feminism?

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Sep 22, 10:36 2019

Here are some videos that deal with women scientist and inventors and some very smart women.

First is this one is about Melitta Bentz born in 1873 in Germany who invented coffee filters; Caresse Crosby b. 1891 in NYC who invented the backless bra and Stephanie Kwolek born in 1923 in Pennsylvania who invented Kevlar. See here (4 ½ minutes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7didcu8lTDI

Next is this video (4 minutes) about Lise Meitner, born in Austria in 1878 who was a Physicist and who helped discover Nuclear Fission; Chien-Shiung Wu, born in China in 1912 who also was a Physicist and who worked on the Manhattan Project and Rosalind Franklin who was a Chemist born in Notting Hill, England in 1920 who Photographed the structure of DNA. See here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7O2pfFStiOY.

Then this video (5 minutes) is about Hedy Lamarr, born in Austria in 1914 who was an Inventor, Katherine Johnson, born in West Virginia in 1918, who worked for NASA and whose life was depicted in the movie “Hidden Figures” and Marilyn Vos Savant born 1946 who scored 228 on an IQ test. The highest score ever recorded: See here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiLZh5gfcvM.

The next video is entitled “Top 10 Greatest Female Scientists” (15 minutes). The ten scientists are Elizabeth Blackburn, worked in Genetics and was a Noble Prize winner; Rachel Carson, an Environmentalist who wrote “Silent Spring;” Barbara McClintock who worked in Genetics, and who discovered “jumping genes;” Dorothy Hodgkin who worked with X-ray crystallography and was a Nobel Prize winner; Rita Levi-Montalcini a 1986 Nobel Medicine Prize winner; Chien-Shiung Wu who worked on the Manhattan Project; Gertrude B. Elion who was a Biochemist and Pharmacologist; Lise Meitner who was part of the team to discover Nuclear Fission; Rosalind Franklin who Photographed the structure of DNA and Marie Curie who was a Physicist and a Chemist who also won Two Noble prizes. Also covered are the following “Honorable Mentions” Jane Goodall, Caroline Herschel, Stephanie Kwolek, Jocelyn Bell Burnell, Temple Grandin and Mary Anning. See Here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWb6-nCiQ2s.

Oh and here is one more female scientist. She is my daughter who is a scientist and a geologist, who is successfully working in her field of endeavor and who is also a mother of two children.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Sep 29, 10:11 2019

There are three videos linked to in this post. In one way they are a continuation of the concept of female sexual pleasure covered in two posts above, but they also deal with an idea that I have been wanting to write about. That idea is what can be called “similarities.” People tend to group objects, ideas and even people into categories. This is helpful in understanding the world, but a problem is that often the differences between the elements of one group and the elements of another group are exaggerated. What I am interested in is how elements in one group are similar to elements in another. This is particularly the case for groups of people. Two such groupings are the sexes. When I write sex I am referring to physical biological features as opposed to gender which include more cultural or emotional features. In the first video, entitled “All About the Clitoris * Female Anatomy Review” (18 minutes) the presenter, Tori, who is a “doctor of physical therapy specializing in pelvic health” talks about the female sexual pleasure organ, the clitoris and compares it to the corresponding male organ, the penis. For a while I have been struck by the similarities of these organs. That they are not exactly the same, but also are not polar opposites and I feel that Tori explains, with the help of playdoh models, her point very well. In her talk she asks is the clitoris a small penis or is the penis a large clitoris? I recommend that people view the video, which can be found here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZ4kbOjm-BY.

In the above video the presenter spoke about Homologues (organs that come from the same developmental tissue, but do not develop exactly the same), such as the clitoris and the penis. She also mentioned female and male nipples as examples of Homologues. Taking this further, here is an article from the “Babycenter” entitled “Can Men Breastfeed?” It is written by Jan Barger, R.N., M.A., IBCLC, FILCA, who is a board-certified lactation consultant. In the article the author writes “Yes, in theory, men can breastfeed. Male breasts have milk ducts, and some mammary tissue. They also have oxytocin and prolactin, the hormones responsible for milk production. See here: https://www.babycenter.com/404_can-men- ... ed_8824.bc. Another article, this one from Scientific American is entitled “Strange but True: Males Can Lactate.” The article gives examples of men lactating and even one case where a man is reported to have “. . . nursed his two daughters through their infancy.” Also presented are cases where the changes in hormones produced by starvation “. . . can cause spontaneous lactation.” See here: https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... n-lactate/. Based on the information from these articles men have the physical structures needed to breast feed. Also, women lactate women only lactate when the correct hormones are produced during their pregnancy.

Another example of a homologue is the ovaries and testis. Both of these organs come from the same development tissue and serve similar purposes. That is they supply the gametes which carry one half of each parent’s chromosomes and each provide certain hormones to the body. They are not exactly the same, but they are not completely different – they are similar.

Here is another video by Tori (31 minutes long). This one is called “All About the Female G-Spot.” In it the presenter mentions (after the 15 minute point) the Skene’s Glands, also called Paraurethral Glands or the female prostate, which “. .. appears to be homologous to the male prostate.” A statement shown in the video is that this “female prostate” also appears to be “. . . the source of a viscous, white secretion, which exits from the urethra upon sexual stimulation in some women. Analysis of this secretion (also known as ‘female ejaculate’) . . . revealed that its composition was unlike urine and often contained components also found in male seminal fluid (minus the sperm).” See here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTtT_RyGyb0.

This third video, also presented by Tori, is entitled “All about Female Ejaculation and Squirting” (20 minutes). The video explains that there seem to be two types of female ejaculation, “true ejaculation, which seems to come from the Skene’s Glands or female prostate and which is white and contains components also found in male seminal fluid (minus the sperm) and squirting which comes from the bladder and is a clear liquid. See here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwmIpAI5Y5k.

I know these videos are long, but I feel they are informative and interesting. Recently, within the past 30 years there has been a great deal new information found out about the female sexual pleasure organs and it seems that what is being learned increasingly suggests similarities between the female sexual pleasure organs and those of the male. I recommend viewing all of them. That does have to be done at one time. You can come back to this post or download the videos and see them later.

This post has been about ways in which females and males are similar, but of course that does not mean that females and males are exactly the same, as, in general females can give birth and can menstruate, while males cannot.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by Endymion » Sun Oct 6, 8:26 2019

This list of women who have campaigned for the nomination to the office of US President is from a list to be found on the Rutgers University’s Center for American Women and Politics (CAWP), see here: https://cawp.rutgers.edu/levels_of_offi ... ected-list. It is not a complete list. Also additional information on these women can be found at the above link.

Victoria Claflin Woodhull (1872), Equal Rights Party, born 1838, founded her own newspaper and was the first woman to own a Wall Street investment firm.

Belva Ann Bennett Lockwood (1884 and 1888), Equal Rights Party, born 1830, admitted to the bar in Washington DC in 1873 and drafted the law which admitted women to practice before the US Supreme Court.

Margaret Chase Smith (1964), “first woman to have her named placed in nomination for President by a major party. Republican Party, born 1897

Shirley Antia Chisholm (1972), “first African American woman to seek a major party’s nomination for US President, Democratic Party, born 1924

Patsy Takemoto Mink (1972), Democratic Party

Ellen McCormack (1976, 1980), Democratic Party

Sonia Johnson (1984), Citizens Party

Patricia S. Schroeder (1988), Democratic Party

Lenora Fulani (1988, 1992), New Alliance Party

Elizabeth Hanford Dole (2000), Republican Party

Carol Moseley Braun (2004), Democratic Party

Michele Bachmann (2012), Republican Party

Jill Stein (2008, 2016), Green Party

Hillary Rodham Clinton (2008, 2016), Democratic Party, first woman nominated by a major party, first woman to win the popular vote.

Carly Fiorina (2016), Republican Party

Tulsi Gabbard (2020), Democratic Party

Kirsten Gillibrand (2020), Democratic Party

Kamala Harris (2020), Democratic Party

Elizabeth Warren (2020), Democratic Party

Marianne Williamson (2020), Democratic Party

Amy Klobuchar (2020), Democratic Party

2020 is a record for the number of women seeking the nomination for President, at least from a major party. Six originally, however with Kirsten Gillibrand dropping out of the race, there now are five. Elizabeth Warren (currently in the Senate, MA) has been increasing in the polls since she started and now is a close second place, as of this posting, see here: https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epoll ... -6730.html.

Three of the other women – Kamala Harris (currently in the Senate, CA), Kirsten Gillibrand (currently in the Senate, NY) and Tulsi Gabbard (currently in the House, HI) – are still young and I expect they will be a strong force in the future. I’m particularly interested in Tulsi Gabbard. She is only 38, she is a Pacific Islander (born in American Samoa), she is Hindu and she is a military veteran (she served two tours of duty in the Middle East and is now a Major in the Army National Guard). As the United States is a diverse nation I strongly feel that the people elected to the government also be diverse.

Since 2004 no white male has won the popular vote. A non-white male or a woman has won the popular vote every time a non-white male or a woman has been a candidate for a major party.

Tom,

To be continued
See here for a topic on Women in history: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50838

See here for a topic on Female Singers: viewtopic.php?f=23&t=50851.

See here for a topic on Female Artists and the Nude: viewtopic.php?f=28&t=50860

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Re: Women in history and an examination of gender norms:

Post by melsbells » Sat Oct 12, 6:01 2019

I'm glad you found my additions from Finland worth while. You might be interested in Tove Jansson (1914-2001), the creator of the Moomins children's books and comic strips. The character of Little My is often used as a symbol of Feminism within Finland. I recently learned that my favorite character, Too-ticky, was based on her partner Tuulikki Pietilä. Here's a short article in English from YLE (Finnish Public Broadcasting) about Pietilä.
Here's a piece from Autostraddle Jansson's queerness.

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